Just got off the phone with a buddy who was helping me work on it - when I left to get another relay he tried jumping the fuel pump through the harness connector straight from the battery (he thinks the fuel pump was dead)... could he have tripped the antitheft in the ignition?

 

Yellow with red tracer....Black with white tracer......That will power the pump...To test

In case it isn't obvious... red+ black-

The anti theft portion of these bikes..... do not get tripped..?

 

I was just worried that trying to jump the pump with the key on through the harness may have caused some kind of issue in the ignition. I can try that to test the pump, but I've still gotta get the bike to crank. The starter issue is what's really driving me crazy.

 

Haha...Ok,I will bite.
Whats the starter issue?
Red to the nut... black to the starter body

 

Fuck. the harness.....Do you have any... just random wires? direct current...to anything you want to test.......the harness could be the issue.
Get a Dmm

 

The odd part is that it would crank fine before he tried jumping the fuel pump through the connector that connects to the relay. The harness on the bike is pretty fucked. Honestly there are open connectors under the tank that I can find no matching plugs for on the bike. But it DID run before I started taking fairings off and shit, so I know it's something between taking the bike apart and now that caused the problem.

 

On US. versions...I believe... there are only two unused plugs....Both are only two wire plugs(carb heater...Light up front)....Anything else should be plugged in.
Stop listening to your friend!!!For one!!!!
,and searching this site will net almost any answer you are after......

 

Randomly applying voltage to terminals has been known to cause blown fuses among other things. Have you checked your fuses?

 

Yes, fuse is good.

 

Hi
Now you have the fairing off ,take a photo of the loose cables and post it I'm sure someone will be able to tell you where to connect them to, pull apart all connectors and give them a clean with WD40 and an old tooth brush. Make sure you check the green ignition connector under the air box. Make sure you have not got any bodged repairs and if so redo them properly. If after all that and there is still no joy get a multi meter and start testing the cables following the wiring diagram as you can not find an electrical fault just by looking at it.

 

put bike in n with key on giggle yellow connector see if pump primes,you checked battery voltage as well?you leave key on lights will drain battery enough to not make bike start.

 

Get a DMM if you don't have one and look up a tutorial or two on how to use it properly. To see if the fuel pump relay is getting power, measure the voltage betweem the O/W (orange/white) and Y/B (yellow/black) terminals in its connector. If you don't get battery voltage there, measure between O/W and a ground point (like the negative battery pole) to see whether the O/W wire is hot. If you don't get battery voltage, you've got some problem with your starter interlock system (kill switch, sidestand switch, sidestand/turn signal relay, ignition switch, GPS or wiring). If you get +12V on O/W but not between O/W and Y/B then the ECU is not grounding the relay. Measure continuity between the relay and the ECU on th Y/B wire to check for a severed cable. Finally, if you do get battery voltage between O/W and Y/B but not between Y/R (yellow/red) and ground then your relay isn't working.

 

Thanks. I've got a DMM and I've been toying around with it. Before I started having issues with the bike not cranking, I checked power to the fuel relay like you described and I was getting power to the relay, but the testing continuity through the relay and not getting anything led me to believe it had failed.

This led to my buddy putting 12v straight to the connector on the harness that plugs into the fuel pump's connector. The pump didn't run, and he got a nice arc at the battery - I'm afraid this might have caused damage to one of the numerous safety switches or to the ECU. This is when I started having problems with the bike not cranking.

I friend had a good working '97 ECU, so I swapped that in with no go.

After looking at the service manual, I tried checking for power to the starter relay and had nothing, which leads me to believe that the problem is in the interlock system.

Am I on the right track? I'm considering bypassing the neutral safety switch, sidestand switch, and the clutch switch to eliminate them as possibilities.

Also, in the manual it references a diode, which looks like a small relay deal that connects to a connector off the harness under the gas tank. I'm not finding that..

 

If O/W checks out and Y/B doesn't, then something's wrong with the ECU. If it's the other way around it's the interlock or some fuse.

After more carefully following your directions and watching some more videos to really understand the DMM, I found that Y/B IS providing voltage, but O/W is not.

Best would be, to be methodical about the way you test. If you don't get +12V on the O/W, start tracing the wire diagram backwards, until you get to the battery. First you'll get to the kill switch, so test that, and continue tracing the O/B wire. You'll get to the sidestand relay. Test that as you did for the fuel pump relay and so on...

This is kind of where I ran into some more problems..

I started by checking switches.

Confirmed continuity in the kill switch in the on position.
Confirmed continuity in the starter button.
Confirmed continuity in the clutch position switch.
Confirmed continuity in the neutral safety switch.
Confirmed continuity in the side-stand switch. (kind of.. as the manual suggests, with the DMM in continuity mode I saw between .5 and .6 in the UP position, but it did not change from 1 to 1.5/1.6 in the down position.)

I also disconnected the negative lead from the battery, and the starter and battery lead from the starter relay. I applied 12v from the battery to the starter relay connector side and confirmed continuity through the lugs that run to the + on the battery and the starter, just as the manual recommends - seems the starter relay is fine.

So, really, the only thing I wasn't able to actually test was what the service manual calls the "Side-Stand Relay." In the manual it depicts it being located to the left of the starter relay, opposite the fuel pump relay. I have nothing there on that bracket.

I have read (but don't fully understand) that somehow the turn signal relay can play into the interlock/sidestand system. There is an Orange/Black wire running from the starter button into the relay, which leads me to believe it has to close to allow the starter to get signal from the starter button?

This lead me to believe maybe that relay had failed. I wasn't able to find a diagram of the relay to figure out where to apply voltage to test it for continuity, and I wasn't able to find any open connectors that looked like they would connect to a relay back near the starter relay.

Perhaps it's not supposed to be there is your model. What part are you referring to in the wiring diagram?

The diode I'm referring to is, per the manual, located under the fuel tank and is part of the side-stand/ignition interlock. I've posted some screenshots of the open connectors under my tank. Maybe there is supposed to be a diode in one of them, but I don't really know what it's supposed to all look like from the factory to tell. Plus, the bike was running previously without any issues (prior to me taking the fairings/gas tank off), so I don't think it was ever there since I got the bike.

Lastly, thank you for your detailed responses.

Pictures:

In this one you'll see there is no side-stand relay as depicted in the service manual.

I've removed the relay in this picture, but this is where I was checking the control switches through their respective connectors.

These are the open connectors under my tank. Obviously the fuel pump isn't connected, but the remaining - I have no idea where they'd go. Maybe the diode is supposed to connect to one of them?

 

CarlSalter.com for a manual......if you don't have one......wiring diagram.

The diode you are searching for.. is a three prong rectangle...say 3/8"x1/2" in there some place.

 

opps

 

try reconnecting everything and give battery a charge,these batterys die fast if you leave lights on to long,plug in rec/reg as well.the relay you removed next to fuse box needs to be in it also controls fuel pump.my 98 wouldn't start if the big relay wasn't seated right.

 

I just took the relay out trying to test it. I found a diagram of the pins so I can actually test it tomorrow.

The battery is sitting at about 12.4 volts which I'd imagine is plenty to turn on all the relays and at least let it crank.

 

Testing the voltage with a multi meter does not show the capacity of the battery to crank over the engine. Always keep it on a tender or just trickle charge over night. You could also keep the MM connected across the battery when trying to start the bike ,the voltage will drop right off it the battery is shot. Not suggesting that it is though.
You should be able to identify those connectors under the tank from the colours using the wiring diagram ,you might find you forgot you unplugged them, easily done. Good luck ,you will sort it.

 

connectors is for carb heater and we don't have it in usa others are just random unused.no diode for kickstand,its just a switch with plunger.did you try the clutch relay?located on left clip on?you can unhook it and put a wire or paper clip in it to bypass it.Not sure if12.4v is enough to start as it will drop with key on.i would try a jumper pack,make sure to reconnect everything before starting,you can also try puttin in gear kick stand up try starting?

 

1) connectors is for carb heater
and we don't have it in usa.
2) others are just random unused.
3) no diode for kickstand,its just a switch with plunger.

#1)correct
White connector. two wires Orange-black
#2) wrong . He has a diagram now
#3)wrong
There is a diode, it hooks between neutral switch,side stand relay, side stand switch,and the neutral light. Seperate from the plunger.

 

Testing the voltage with a multi meter does not show the capacity of the battery to crank over the engine. Always keep it on a tender or just trickle charge over night. You could also keep the MM connected across the battery when trying to start the bike ,the voltage will drop right off it the battery is shot. Not suggesting that it is though.
You should be able to identify those connectors under the tank from the colours using the wiring diagram ,you might find you forgot you unplugged them, easily done. Good luck ,you will sort it.

 

I'm afraid I can't comment on your photos, as I'm not familiar with your particular model. I just looked up a wiring diagram online to see if I could help you out. Perhaps I should have mentioned that.

The diagram I have is this one and now I see this is for a 750 model, while you have a 600. Can someone confirm whether it's identical to the wiring diagram for your model, or better yet, post the wiring diagram here, if it's not against site rules?

Anyway, going by that diagram, you should follow the O/W wire until you get to the battery as described. The O/W wire is fed from the O/B wire going into the engine stop switch which is in turn fed from the O/Y wire going into the sidestand relay. Since you haven't checked the latter yet, let's stop there for now. You need to find it and see whether you get battery voltage on the O/Y wire (measuring against ground). There should be two O/Y wires going into the relay, which electrically are the same. Measure both. Also measure the G wire going into the relay agains the positive pole to see if it's grounding the relay.

Double-check the above against the diagram in your manual. The one I'm referring to might be different. How many terminals does your missing diode have and what wire colors are going into it?

 

The frustrating part of that is that my side stand relay just isn't where it's listed in the service manual. Everything I'm reading implies it's located near the back of the bike. The only other relay in my harness aside from the fuel pump and starter relay is the turn signal relay on the front half of the harness where the fuse block is. There is an O/B wire running to it from the kill switch. Maybe on the 97 it was integreated into the turn signal relay? It's a 7 pin relay. Further down the diagram it implies the diode is near the side-stand switch and the neutral switch, but again, not finding any empty connectors off of that section of the harness.

I feel like I've been over this thing 100 times. I've checked every ground I can and replaced every relay except the starter relay, which tested out good. I know every switch is working. If the side stand relay is also the turn signal relay then the only thing, per the interlock system, is the diode.

Aaaaand as I'm typing this I realized I haven't checked any of the fuses in the fuse block in the front half of the harness. Only the 30a on the starter relay.

EDIT: As I'm typing this I realize I'm an idiot, because there is a completely broken down wire harness routing guide in the service manual I must have skipped over 100 times. The turn signal relay IS the side-stand relay for the interlock. So... I really have checked or replaced everything except the fuse block (which seems obvious now), the ignition cylinder itself (the key is a little janky..), and the diode (which is ninja as fuck apparently.)

DOUBLE EDIT! - For reference, this is the diagram:

 

I use Haynes manual. color coded...Has all the versions...US. anyway...However I don't use photobucket......or the likes....So posting it is pointless...as it will be blurry...If anybody is interested..I can email them a pic of the appropriate ones....To be uploaded via an uploader (photobucket)etc.

 

Well, fuck me.. I got bundled up and went over to the shop to check the fuse block, and the ignition fuse came out in 2 pieces. Swapped the fuse for the tail lights in it's place and the bike cranked right over. I feel pretty dumb now, going straight to the more complicated shit.

Now I've still gotta figure out the fuel pump not running. I'm getting power to the relay, and the relay is brand new, so I THINK I might have disturbed the power or ground wire on the assembly inside the tank when I was moving it around... maybe. I'm going to investigate that tomorrow, hopefully with more grace than I used on the starter issue.

 

PM me your email...I will send you an easier to read full color diagram?

 

ebay has the pump and strainer petcock all for 80$

 

Yep, that's what I'm getting!

 

Get the one with the black rubber piece also...if yours is no good...those weren't available until recently...who knows how many will be made!

 

$99 comes with pump plate also.

 

Not seeing one that comes with the plate and gasket. You got a link?

 

I'll get the number...All I searched was srad fuel pump. unno

 

#252271283545....9mysticcobra6

 

Well hell, there ya go. Ordered, thanks again man.