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2001 GSXR 1000, 2019 Hyabusa
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Bike sat for a bit was running fine before that, suddenly would try and start but not. I checked the fuel tank and it looked like the tank coat had dissolved.. cleaned the tank, replaced the fuel pump, replaced the injectors, cleaned the fuel rail etc. (new plugs) on test the bike started without the air cleaner assembly on and I thought all was good. Once I plugged everything in it would not start. I tracked it down to the IAP sensor, once I disconnected the vacuum line to that sensor it started right up but a bit rough. If I totally disconnect the IAP sensor and the AP sensor under the seat it runs fine. I replaced the sensor same problem, I actually got two off Ebay and tried both and no go.. same thing. I tried using the rear one in place of the front. Same deal. I've seen a few threads about something like this but it seems it always ended with the guy forgot to attach the vacuum line (this is not that).
 

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"looked like the tank coat had dissolved"
Tank coat? What's that about?

"replaced the fuel pump"
The $850 pump assembly or just a $50 aftermarket pump motor?

It sounds like it might not be getting enough fuel. Have you tried priming it through the throttle body?
 

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Dreaming of buttsecks for years...
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Or too much fuel. It sucking air with the IAP hoses removed. What if you hook the hoses back up and just open the throttle a bit?
 

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I don't think it was attitude. 4 days with no response is a bit discouraging.....
 

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I don't think it was attitude. 4 days with no response is a bit discouraging.....
This place doesn't have the same traffic, and patience is a virtue. (y)(y)
 

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I think it was 3 days when I posted. Sometimes things get overlooked. Also newbies are always viewed by me with suspicion. I'm recently annoyed by one in the K7/K8 section. I promptly provided what I suspect is the correct diagnosis but got no reply. I've since discovered that he posted the same in another forum and has been going back and forth there with off-target responses.

I'm waiting for more info here from the OP but am wondering if the main fuel filter might be clogged.
 

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I think it was 3 days when I posted. Sometimes things get overlooked. Also newbies are always viewed by me with suspicion. I'm recently annoyed by one in the K7/K8 section. I promptly provided what I suspect is the correct diagnosis but got no reply. I've since discovered that he posted the same in another forum and has been going back and forth there with off-target responses.

I'm waiting for more info here from the OP but am wondering if the main fuel filter might be clogged.

Thanks Bill.
We are fortunate to have you & Geek provide the site with all the help.
 

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2001 GSXR 1000, 2019 Hyabusa
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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
It's getting 50lbs pressure on the new pump, The IAP hose is plugged just not connected to the sensor, when you connect it to the sensor is when it dies. Without either sensor plugged in it starts and revs just like normal. Tanks are coated (internally) with an anti rust coating that can deteriorate over time and ethanol fuel sitting in it. It starts and runs but rather ragged with the sensors plugged in but no vacuum connect. When you connect the vacuum hose it kills the bike.
 

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Pressure is only half the test for the pump. How much volume does it deliver in 10 seconds?
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Pressure is only half the test for the pump. How much volume does it deliver in 10 seconds?
The bike runs fine without the vacuum connected as I've described, revs 8-9k no problem. I can hold it there with no problem. I'm thinking it might be an ECU problem at this point but I don't have another to swap out and apparently there is no diagnostic for that ECU (other then the codes which when all is plugged in the bike has none -C00).
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Pressure is only half the test for the pump. How much volume does it deliver in 10 seconds?
I'm going to run it a bit then pull a couple plugs and look at them see what that tells me.
 

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How did you make the pressure measurement? I'm assuming that the pump outlet was deadheaded or otherwise not flowing fuel, in which case it's better than nothing, but not a lot. It would have meaning if you were measuring it while riding. 50 psi is too high unless your gauge isn't reading very accurately. The pressure should be more like 43 psi (300 kPa). Over 45 psi is suspect. Do the flow test.

You haven't mentioned any error codes. Are you getting C13 and C22 when the sensors are unplugged?
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
How did you make the pressure measurement? I'm assuming that the pump outlet was deadheaded or otherwise not flowing fuel, in which case it's better than nothing, but not a lot. It would have meaning if you were measuring it while riding. 50 psi is too high unless your gauge isn't reading very accurately. The pressure should be more like 43 psi (300 kPa). Over 45 psi is suspect. Do the flow test.

You haven't mentioned any error codes. Are you getting C13 and C22 when the sensors are unplugged?
I mentioned earlier about codes, I can hold the bike at 5-6-7-8k and higher for several seconds and it runs fine comes right back to idle. I did a Quantum fuel pump, new o-rings, new filter, new pressure regulator. I'm really not thinking it's the fuel pump (it was actually the second pump I put in I did a kemso first and it would only get 30lbs so I returned it). I'm going to pull some plugs tomorrow and take a look (they are new as well). I do have a power commander 3 on the bike but I've bypassed it and no difference as far as the issue. Like I said earlier I am suspecting it may be an issue with the ECU but I've not another to swap in (or I could rule that out fast). I appreciate the suggestions ..Thanks.
 

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"new filter"
Which one, the strainer or the $430 main/real filter (#2 here)?

ECM's can fail but they're generally fairly robust. It wouldn't hurt to remove the connectors and check for corrosion of the contacts.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
"new filter"
Which one, the strainer or the $430 real filter?

ECM's can fail but they're generally fairly robust. It wouldn't hurt to remove the connectors and check for corrosion of the contacts.
Well I suppose you'd call it more a strainer, I am unaware of any other filter on that fuel pump, unless you mean the whole filter assembly that the pressure regulator is plugged into. Starting to get cold here I've spent the whole summer trying to get this thing right, Luckily I have several other bikes, I bought the last new Hyabusa I could find in Colorado so that's been fun maybe the 1000 is jealous and just refusing to cooperate. I made myself a promise when I bought the Hyabusa I'd not ride it till I got the 1000 running because I didn't want to get to the end of summer and still not have it running. I held out for about a month, then I gave in cause damn the summer was passing by.
 

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The main high pressure fuel filter is inside the sealed plastic assembly of Item # 2 that cost $431.20 in Bills link above.

It's a non serviceable unit, you have to replace the whole assembly (item # 2)

Here is pic of the main high pressure fuel filter element cut out the plastic housing, rendering it useless.



This is the filter that clogs up and starves the engine of fuel under load, not the strainer on the inlet to the pump.

So many people replace the fuel pump on the cheap, but the vast majority of the time there is nothing wrong with the pump, its the $431.20 main filter which is clogged up causing fuel starvation issues.

The fuel free flow test is the fastest and easiest way to test if the main filter is clogged up or not.

Disconnect the fuel line from the fuel tank.

Connect a rubber hose from the fuel tank pump outlet and run it into a measuring jug.

Supply 12 Volts to the fuel pump and run it continuously for exactly 30 seconds.

After 30 seconds of running the pump, 1200mls of fuel should of been discharged into the measuring jug to past the free flow test per the OEM service manual.

You can also test the fuel pump by it self, by doing the free flow test with the pump disconnected from the main filter if you pull it apart.

If it falls the free flow test, testing the fuel pump on its own without the filter attached, will show if the fuel pump is still good or not.

Then you can buy only the items that need replacing, instead of randomly replacing parts stabbing in the dark.

Yes.... the OEM main filter assembly is a complete rip off @ $431.20.....................................
 

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2001 GSXR 1000, 2019 Hyabusa
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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
The main high pressure fuel filter is inside the sealed plastic assembly of Item # 2 that cost $431.20 in Bills link above.

It's a non serviceable unit, you have to replace the whole assembly (item # 2)

Here is pic of the main high pressure fuel filter element cut out the plastic housing, rendering it useless.



This is the filter that clogs up and starves the engine of fuel under load, not the strainer on the inlet to the pump.

So many people replace the fuel pump on the cheap, but the vast majority of the time there is nothing wrong with the pump, its the $431.20 main filter which is clogged up causing fuel starvation issues.

The fuel free flow test is the fastest and easiest way to test if the main filter is clogged up or not.

Disconnect the fuel line from the fuel tank.

Connect a rubber hose from the fuel tank pump outlet and run it into a measuring jug.

Supply 12 Volts to the fuel pump and run it continuously for exactly 30 seconds.

After 30 seconds of running the pump, 1200mls of fuel should of been discharged into the measuring jug to past the free flow test per the OEM service manual.

You can also test the fuel pump by it self, by doing the free flow test with the pump disconnected from the main filter if you pull it apart.

If it falls the free flow test, testing the fuel pump on its own without the filter attached, will show if the fuel pump is still good or not.

Then you can buy only the items that need replacing, instead of randomly replacing parts stabbing in the dark.

Yes.... the OEM main filter assembly is a complete rip off @ $431.20.....................................
I did that more or less at one point just cycling the ignition several times (I know not exactly the same but it looked good flow wise) I was afraid that assembly had a filter in it. I'm still confused the bike is idling and running fine without the vacuum plugged into the IAP, why would plugging the vacuum into the IAP kill the bike? I will go ahead and do the test again using the 30 second deal just to be sure. Thanks for that pic, I don't understand why they would make that non replaceable.
 
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