Suzuki GSX-R Motorcycle Forums Gixxer.com banner

161 - 180 of 189 Posts

·
IMMITIGABLY VERBOSE DUDE
Joined
·
2,051 Posts
Blitz, be careful or you might make "mental" sound like a favorable condition... and rationalize the rest of your irrational decisions along with it. Don't look for ME to stop you, though, because you may just make me look sensible if you keep at it... and I like the superfluous as much as the hyperbole... build it like you married it, and love her for all the salacious reasons that helped justify her cray-cray the other 90% of the time... why you tied the knot in the first place. :D


-crisp
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,472 Posts
Discussion Starter #162
K... So... Java hasn't chimed back in so I'm guessing he's filed me under "why do I even bother" - which truth be told - I have filed a few guys filed under that tab myself... and I get it... He's a monster here and deserves respect for every word he's taken the time to type... Any way - this is the "build thread" for my beloved RD/BK '91.

I've given myself license to "DWETFIW" (do whatever the fu*k I want) to this specimen, even if it's SILLY (my word of choice when STUPID would be considered coarse) as I've got another '91 (BL/WH) that's got 2900 miles on it with minimal molestation (YOSH race only pipe, polished edges on the rims, blue mirrors form the '91 750, and a blue windscreen) and all OEM stuff to put it all back to showroom, (including the trim for the trailing edge of the windscreen. The OEM white mirrors were "very" expensive.) so given that it sits in my living room (I have more bikes than friends) in a pickled state with only my son's drool on it (I actually pay the maid to "stay the fuck away from that"))...

Him - "Dad... I know you want to be buried with it, but California won't allow that... Would you take $7000.00?"
Me - "No. Your sister can have it, you'll just toss it, besides that - you really want the red one...."

I am "DWETFIW".....

So Plan A - Just scored (paid close to asking price - thank you all for buying all my "left-overs") a set of PM wheels with cush drive, '90 1100 APE built head (O/S valves, HD springs Ti retainers, porting), and a Weisco 1216 piston kit. Ordered billet 370/370 cams and a head oiler kit. Installing a secondary cooler as stated above either up front or in the tail to feed the top end oiler and valve cover fittings all in parallel. I want to run it on pump gas without having to do rods/crank and " get more of everything" rather than all top end HP. All to be mated with the 38mm RS's, and a 750 Ti duplex with a 2" collector at the mid pipe.

Sound like a solid plan?

Other plans -
Wheels, PM Chicanes, Gold anodized (????) - Would like to know if "Mr. Chalet" aka "Le Skid" could render pic's with proposed mods... hmmm...
Forks, Gold anodized uppers, Black DLC sliders, Black anodized axle/caliper lugs.
EBC Pro-Lite rotors
Yosh rearsets
Etc.....

Curious on your thoughts for anodizing wheels or anything else.

Cheers!!

pic -
1- Before "she who shall remain nameless" turned left - putting it on the lift since 2010...
2- Living-room Princess
 

Attachments

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
5,441 Posts
K... So... Java hasn't chimed back in so I'm guessing he's filed me under "why do I even bother" -
Well, I figured you got my message the first couple of times....

I can keep beating this dead horse if you think it would do any good.

JR
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
5,441 Posts
I have respect for any man that parks his motorcycle in the living room. Women be damned
I don't know if I would damn all women, but I have found it better to just build an addition to the house to house the cars and bikes. They get their living room, I build a bigger room for my crap...

JR
 

·
IMMITIGABLY VERBOSE DUDE
Joined
·
2,051 Posts
I don't know if I would damn all women, but I have found it better to just build an addition to the house to house the cars and bikes. They get their living room, I build a bigger room for my crap...

JR

...or... buy a new home for the family and wife and KEEP the "old place" to provide a man-cave and motorcycle "home"... :D

-crisp
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,472 Posts
Discussion Starter #167
Put a second cooler up front, or just run the main cooler with changes to the bodywork to get air in and out more effectively. You can improve a stock cooler's performance by just paying a little attention to the airflow.

JR
JR - Any hints on what can be done with the bodywork to achieve better air flow? If I can do something to the stuff I have without having to repaint it would be preferable, if not... go the next step? Get some AirTech and save some weight at the same time? If I go that far, NOW is the time to make that decision.

Specifics?:dunno

EDIT*
Now that I think about it - I have this set I could use - not wild about the colors, but if I'm to chop some stuff up, this would be it as it's already paid for... Anyone modified an AirTech upper to take headlights, HID's etc??
 

Attachments

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,472 Posts
Discussion Starter #168
I don't know if I would damn all women, but I have found it better to just build an addition to the house to house the cars and bikes. They get their living room, I build a bigger room for my crap...

JR
My rule of thumb is that the garage is mine and the house is theirs.... My current relationship status is that we each have our own place but I know she's a great gal because she not only has no issue with the bike in the house but actually likes it enough she posted it on her FB page... I pickled it and brought it in to keep me from being tempted to put any more miles on it. So far - so good.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
5,441 Posts
Best thing you can do for the airflow is to make and install some air guides that force the air to go through the cooler, not above and below it, or to the sides.

You can make a front fairing bracket from aluminum that incorporates a mount for one or two lights, your choice. Cut and shape a suitable hole in the fairing upper. Add a layer of glass or aluminum on the back side of the hole to create a flange for a plastic headlight cover, which you make out of a thin, thermosetting plastic. You can add a shroud to either the mounting bracket, or the back side of the fairing opening, to keep stray light from bothering you when riding at night.

When the female of choice gets older, your bike will no longer be welcome in the house. Trust me on this.

JR
 

·
IMMITIGABLY VERBOSE DUDE
Joined
·
2,051 Posts
...but I know she's a great gal because she not only has no issue with the bike in the house but actually likes it enough she posted it on her FB page... So far - so good.

Son, put a ring on that woman and marry her... one of two things will happen:

1) You live happily ever after! :)

2) She turns into a pumpkin and you wake up with a Jack-O-Lantern-Demon-Dame leaning over you with seared pumpkin-puke oozing out of her Jack-O-Jaw and a Breaker-Bar-Brain-Basher flurry of wrath 'cause the foyer reeks of motor oil...

May your future be paved with what is behind "Curtain Number ONE"! :D


-crisp
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
879 Posts
I assure you that unless you have a cool high flow airstream to your cooler, it is just a wide spot in the oil line and dead weight. After seeing oil pan temperatures at various riding situations with the very large stock oil cooler, it takes lots of cool air (read high speeds) to reduce or maintain. A smaller cooler will be even less effective.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
879 Posts
Son, put a ring on that woman and marry her... one of two things will happen:

1) You live happily ever after! :)

2) She turns into a pumpkin and you wake up with a Jack-O-Lantern-Demon-Dame leaning over you with seared pumpkin-puke oozing out of her Jack-O-Jaw and a Breaker-Bar-Brain-Basher flurry of wrath 'cause the foyer reeks of motor oil...

May your future be paved with what is behind "Curtain Number ONE"! :D


-crisp
2b) She divorces you and takes half your stuff

2c) You sell all your man toys and learn to say 'yes dear' and 'you are so right dear'
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,472 Posts
Discussion Starter #173
Best thing you can do for the airflow is to make and install some air guides that force the air to go through the cooler, not above and below it, or to the sides.

You can make a front fairing bracket from aluminum that incorporates a mount for one or two lights, your choice. Cut and shape a suitable hole in the fairing upper. Add a layer of glass or aluminum on the back side of the hole to create a flange for a plastic headlight cover, which you make out of a thin, thermosetting plastic. You can add a shroud to either the mounting bracket, or the back side of the fairing opening, to keep stray light from bothering you when riding at night.

JR
OK - I'm with ya, good insight, especially about the light bleed from the back... So actively re-directing air at the front through the coolers - Do you think there's any risk of losing direct cooling at the cylinder / head fins and thereby increasing the engine temps?

I suppose depending on the lighting apparatus, there might be enough room for a cooler in the upper fairing. Did any of the endurance bikes do this?

When the female of choice gets older, your bike will no longer be welcome in the house. Trust me on this.

JR
I'll let her and my grand daughter figure that out, I'm good either way....
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,472 Posts
Discussion Starter #174
I assure you that unless you have a cool high flow airstream to your cooler, it is just a wide spot in the oil line and dead weight. After seeing oil pan temperatures at various riding situations with the very large stock oil cooler, it takes lots of cool air (read high speeds) to reduce or maintain. A smaller cooler will be even less effective.
Won't get any argument, I've considered a fan, especially for the in town riding necessary to get to the ultimate riding areas, but even that I think would still only constitute a "it's better than nothing" measure.

I initially tried and failed to find some way to mount it in front of the stock cooler due to fender clearance issues under full compression, but JR (and now you) have convinced me to re-investigate that route..

Tanks (that's Irish for "thanks")
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
5,441 Posts
Lots of endurance bikes had a nose cooler, plus lights. Look at all the SERT bikes, for ideas.

I'd rather get air to a cooler than cylinder fins. Any air leaving the cooler will go past the fins and pick up some additional heat.

JR
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
879 Posts
I thought about mounting a cooler fan too in the event I ever built a big engine, but alas never got around to doing either. My guess it would only help a little, mainly in stop and go traffic. Also attempted fitting a second cooler in front of the stock cooler, but like you, could not get enough clearance from the forks at full lock
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,472 Posts
Discussion Starter #178
OK.... So....(Colorado/California introductory statement)....

"Doesn't Suck" is at Moses's place in San Jose getting 1216 jugs / pistons and an APE head with Megacycle cams as addressed here earlier... good to have this project back on track after 4+ years.....

Back to the oil cooling....

Been wondering about oil cooler flow. oldgixxer will get this, and probably others...

With what I THINK is going on in a traditional "row" type cooler... I am a plumber and if two vessels are plumbed in parallel with in's and out's connected in a direct return (without a "reverse return" configuration) you could get a flow differential of as much as 40% between the two vessels (70% through the first "in" and 30% through the 2nd "in") as the path of least resistance will short circuit the secondary paths. A solution would be a "series" or "serpentine" cooler path for an oil cooler would be fine (but for a dual water heater or filter system would be a rookie mistake)... the best and appropriate configuration would be the aforementioned "reverse return" connection.... see attached....

Question is.... I think our stock coolers (and aftermarket for that matter) are the "OK" type flow pattern as shown in the attached ("ok" is a relative term).... In my business this is a BIG FUCKING DEAL. As I am spending an official "SHITLOAD" of $$$$ I want to maximize my dollahhhhs and from what I see without cross sectioning a cooler, our coolers and most aftermarket "row" type coolers are the WORST for balanced flow through a set of pathways.

So... I'm thinking a "serpentine" "cooooooollllleeeeerrrr" would be the most practical given that I don't have tooling equipment to modify standard coolers to a "reverse return" connection.



Serpentine (series) types would be better, and "reverse return" best...




.
Thoughts????
 

Attachments

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,472 Posts
Discussion Starter #179
here's a j.peg... BTW... A non "reverse return" set-up is indisputably a poor way to balance flow through a set of pathways... which to me says that we are losing cooling potential for each sq. in. of space.... just saying...

And "GO BRONCOS!!!"
 

Attachments

·
IMMITIGABLY VERBOSE DUDE
Joined
·
2,051 Posts
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fluid_dynamics

Okay, so I am no expert here, but have understood flow dynamics a little differently from your proposed theories in the diagrams.

1) I believe either the first or last image flow equally and distribute equally through the cooling grid.

Fluid flow and pressure should be constant and evenly distributed if I understand the principles correctly.

2) Your second "serpentine" configuration would cool least efficiently because there is a finite differential between the incoming temperature and what the cooling surface area of the fins with ambient air passing through it can dissipate at a given flow rate.

If there is only so much "cooling to be had" theough the cooler as can be physically transferred by air passing over it, then you want as much oil diffused across the surface area for the ideal duration to net that temperature differential, not the same amount of oil passing over the heat exchanging feature longer. Unless there continues to additional cooling progressively through the cooler "serpent" that benefits the need of the heat exchange that feeds back into the motor, I think you would reach a point of diminishing return and expose less volume per minute of flow for the differential of temperature that is gained and/or necessary. Ideally, the goal isn't to achieve the "coolest" oil temperature possible, but the optimum temperature for ideal engine operation... I think.

That's all a bunch of guessing to get this thread flowing again relative your new proposition. :D

Who's next and actually knows what they are talking about? ;)

-crisp
 
161 - 180 of 189 Posts
About this Discussion
188 Replies
29 Participants
crispone
Suzuki GSX-R Motorcycle Forums Gixxer.com
A forum community dedicated to the Suzuki GSX-R motorcycle. Discuss the GSX-R600, GSX-R750, GSX-R1000, and GSX-R1100, and more!
Full Forum Listing
Top