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post #1 of 33 (permalink) Old 04-10-2012, 09:29 PM Thread Starter
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Dirty Calipers

So I went to the track today for the first time this season.It looked like it was going to be a promising day with good weather and plenty track time.I went my first session and took it very easy since I changed a lot of the stuff on the bike over the winter and I was still tring to get used to the way the bike felt.After all it was only the first session.

After the first lap I started to pick up my pace which is still slow since I'm a "new jack" to the track game.I noticed that my brake lever was becoming stiff and that my brakes felt like they didn't have adequate stopping power.I continued to ride but all of a sudden,on one of the shorter straights,it felt like my bike wasn't revving and I was loosing power.Little that I knew,my front brakes were locked up and I was dragging my front tire.After about a 100 ft my bike stopped and wouldn't budge.At that point I had to leave it where it stopped and the session got red flagged.The crash truck came and I got the bike back to the paddock.

I figured it I must have had too much brake fluid and when it heated up it locked up the brakes.I talked to a couple of different people and they thought the same so I took some fluid out and went out the next session.Same fucking thing happened!I felt it coming on this time but I wasn't able to get it back to the pits before the brakes totally locked up on me again.I was done for the day.

Back at my pit I thought about what I changed in regard to the brakes over the winter.New brake pads,new lines,new levers,new fluid but I never cleaned and rebuilt the calipers.Now,my bike is an 04 so I think they haven't been touched in 10 years.With some great advice on what to do from Kaz(SPL170db),who is one of the guys I met here and see at the track,I managed to take the calipers apart when I got home.What do you guys think looking at these?Could this have been my problem?
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post #2 of 33 (permalink) Old 04-10-2012, 09:56 PM
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Re: Dirty Calipers

What brand of levers

I am going to guess cheap knockoffs............ do I win?

The trash in the one caliper piston well was not helping. that is for sure. But I DOUBT any of that was causing your issue.

One of three things I have seen causes brakes to lock up under use. One is cheap knockoff levers.

Two, is too much fluid in the reservoir

three, is extremely wet fluid, which when it heats up flashes the water into steam basically, and the steam pressure applies the brakes, which causes more heat, and more pressure in a cascading issue.





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post #3 of 33 (permalink) Old 04-10-2012, 09:56 PM
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Re: Dirty Calipers

from the looks of these calipers, I dont see anything obvious that would cause your prollem. But I would have a close look at the master cylinder, there is a very small hole that allows the fluid to return to the reservoir when the piston returns to the relaxed position.. might be pluged??
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post #4 of 33 (permalink) Old 04-10-2012, 10:39 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Dirty Calipers

Could be the levers but they worked fine when I rode around the paddock and on the first lap.Plus both sessions it happened around the same time during the second lap.The fluid is brand new Motul 600 from a freshly opened bottle.I used your bleeding method Joe,which worked well.I will change the levers to stock just in case.I guess I should take off the master and clean it too,huh?

Some of the pistons were very hard to remove,I had to use compressed air.Mainly the ones with all the shit in them.If those pistons weren't compressing,could then there be too much fluid pressing on pistons that were working causing those to lock up?Just trying to work on some theories here.
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post #5 of 33 (permalink) Old 04-10-2012, 10:44 PM
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Re: Dirty Calipers

what are the levers?

And yes, they will take time if it is the levers. Are they cheap knockoff levers? if so I almost guarantee it is them.



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post #6 of 33 (permalink) Old 04-11-2012, 12:12 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Dirty Calipers

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what are the levers?

And yes, they will take time if it is the levers. Are they cheap knockoff levers? if so I almost guarantee it is them.
These are the the cheap knock offs.I had the same type last year at the track and they worked fine.That being said Im going to change them out anyway.I just looked at the brake lever and the small piece with a hole in it that the master cylinder piston goes into seems to be real loose.It could be that it rotated and the piston fell out of the hole.
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post #7 of 33 (permalink) Old 04-11-2012, 12:15 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Dirty Calipers

By the way I put a small 1/8 scratch in one of the caliper pistons when I had to wiggle it out with the pliers.Do I need to change it out?
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post #8 of 33 (permalink) Old 04-11-2012, 06:11 AM
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Re: Dirty Calipers

Yes. YOu need a new piston. That scratch can cause a leak. It ALSO has happened in the past that people who had issues with their brakes not holding a firm lever, had a scratch on a piston letting air by.

As for the levers, same type or not, that is the problem with the chinese levers. They are not consistent at all. Id bet good money that is your original issue



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post #9 of 33 (permalink) Old 04-11-2012, 06:50 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Dirty Calipers

Thanks Joe,I guess some lessons are best learned the hard way.What kind of levers do you use?I was thinking go back to stock or get ASV,maybe...
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post #10 of 33 (permalink) Old 04-11-2012, 07:14 AM
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Re: Dirty Calipers

Ive used ASV and Pazzo levers, both great quality.
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post #11 of 33 (permalink) Old 04-11-2012, 07:22 AM
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Re: Dirty Calipers

read the first post, then the 40th post, then read on...

https://www.gixxer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=298233

chinese levers caused a crash.
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post #12 of 33 (permalink) Old 04-11-2012, 07:26 AM
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post #13 of 33 (permalink) Old 04-11-2012, 07:35 AM
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Re: Dirty Calipers

Don't forget to get new crush washers for the banjo bolts. You need 5 for the stock lines and 4 for aftermarket lines.
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post #14 of 33 (permalink) Old 04-11-2012, 07:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nycrider View Post
Thanks Joe,I guess some lessons are best learned the hard way.What kind of levers do you use?I was thinking go back to stock or get ASV,maybe...
Right now I have a pazzo on one side and an fp on the other. I have also used asv with no issues. The fp'a are probably best bang for buck.



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post #15 of 33 (permalink) Old 04-11-2012, 09:13 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 600k2 View Post
Don't forget to get new crush washers for the banjo bolts. You need 5 for the stock lines and 4 for aftermarket lines.
I ordered new seals but no crushwashers I will add that to the order,Thanks Tom.
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post #16 of 33 (permalink) Old 04-11-2012, 09:15 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Moto_Joe View Post
Right now I have a pazzo on one side and an fp on the other. I have also used asv with no issues. The fp'a are probably best bang for buck.
I was thinking asv shorty on the clutch side and a long one on the brake side.I will ored them from motomummy today.
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post #17 of 33 (permalink) Old 04-14-2012, 02:55 AM
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Re: Dirty Calipers

those rings of gunk around each piston are your problem. 100% that is your issue. cheap levers or not, those pistons need to be clean to slide properly.
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post #18 of 33 (permalink) Old 04-14-2012, 05:24 AM
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Re: Dirty Calipers

NYC, i have a few spare/new crush washers if you need them. i buy 20 at a time. i like to have alot of spare parts when at the track. cause you never know if you or a fellow rider might need them.
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post #19 of 33 (permalink) Old 04-14-2012, 08:03 AM
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Re: Dirty Calipers

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those rings of gunk around each piston are your problem. 100% that is your issue. cheap levers or not, those pistons need to be clean to slide properly.

Bullshit.

The rings of dust around the pistons needs to be clean. Sure. But it is there after one ride after cleaning them. I clean mine after ever race weekend.

But there are guys who dont EVER clean the outside of the calipers. The dust wont cause them to lock up.

You say 100% the problem, I say 0% the problem. The dust will likely help contribute to brake fade, but the LEVER is almost certainly what caused his brakes to lock up.



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post #20 of 33 (permalink) Old 04-14-2012, 08:40 AM
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Re: Dirty Calipers

Quote:
Originally Posted by 600k2 View Post
read the first post, then the 40th post, then read on...

https://www.gixxer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=298233

chinese levers caused a crash.
Posts 40 and 52 together are freaking golden. Just a few days to fail and cause a crash. and then people continue insisting Chinese levers are fine.
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