Fork leg allen bolt spinning - Suzuki GSX-R Motorcycle Forums Gixxer.com

 
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post #1 of 16 (permalink) Old 08-09-2019, 06:28 AM Thread Starter
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Fork leg allen bolt spinning

HI,
Replacing the seals on my 92 750 (with 99 forks i think). Unscrewed the caps and drained the oil and then remembered to take out the allen bolts at the bottom of the fork legs. One of them came out fine, I cracked it and it backed right out. The other just spins and spins. I've tried screwing the cap back on and cranking down the preload but that has no effect. Also tried spinning it super fast with an impact driver and still just spins. Also tried removing the rebound valve and sticking a steel or a wood thing in that little hole to contact the threaded part that the bolt goes into. Spinsville.

Any other ideas? I'd like to avoid taking the spring off but it looks like I may have to.

Also the part in question is not shown in any manual or exploded diagram.
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post #2 of 16 (permalink) Old 08-09-2019, 08:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2bag_ugly View Post
HI,
Replacing the seals on my 92 750 (with 99 forks i think). Unscrewed the caps and drained the oil and then remembered to take out the allen bolts at the bottom of the fork legs. One of them came out fine, I cracked it and it backed right out. The other just spins and spins. I've tried screwing the cap back on and cranking down the preload but that has no effect. Also tried spinning it super fast with an impact driver and still just spins. Also tried removing the rebound valve and sticking a steel or a wood thing in that little hole to contact the threaded part that the bolt goes into. Spinsville.

Any other ideas? I'd like to avoid taking the spring off but it looks like I may have to.

Also the part in question is not shown in any manual or exploded diagram.
That bolt holds the cartridge in. Once it was loosened, now the cartridge is just spinning with the bolt. I use an impact and keep pressing the button to shock it (versus holding the button down). It will come out. Do the reverse to install making sure the bolt is started before using the impact. Once the cartridge bites and the bolt is snug, then use a torque wrench.

Go to ronayers.com for a diagram. Browse to order OEM parts and they have the fiche.
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post #3 of 16 (permalink) Old 08-09-2019, 09:00 AM
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Re: Fork leg allen bolt spinning

The cartridge does not have to come out to replace the seals, but the springs and top caps have to come off. As a rule of thumb I never mess with the cartridge holding bolt until I'm ready to take it out with an impact gun; once its lose and the cartridge is spinning you're basically SOL and will need a cartridge holder.
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post #4 of 16 (permalink) Old 08-09-2019, 09:45 AM
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It doesn't HAVE to come out, but I always remove it to thoroughly clean. Otherwise you will need a 2 foot long q-tip to get all of the crud out of the bottom of the fork. Pump it several times to remove all of the old oil.

Note there will be a bronze crush washer on that bolt to seal it.

I have done it multiple times using my method and never had to use a cartridge holder.
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post #5 of 16 (permalink) Old 08-09-2019, 05:36 PM
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Re: Fork leg allen bolt spinning

I presume they are right way up forks? get a torch (flash light) and look down in to the fork leg and you will see a hex hole, that is the part that is spinning.
you need to make a tool to fit in that hex so you can remove the cap screw.
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post #6 of 16 (permalink) Old 08-09-2019, 09:36 PM
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Originally Posted by Karitane Pete View Post
I presume they are right way up forks? get a torch (flash light) and look down in to the fork leg and you will see a hex hole, that is the part that is spinning.
you need to make a tool to fit in that hex so you can remove the cap screw.
That would be a 20" deep socket...lol

Unless it is cross-threaded, the impact approach will work. Trust me... if you don't have one, borrow one from Advance Auto, etc.

In order to use an impact, you will need a hex (5mm?) to 1/4" drive. Most 3/8" sockets will not fit in the counter-bore of the fork. Again, you could borrow one.
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post #7 of 16 (permalink) Old 08-10-2019, 02:00 AM
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Re: Fork leg allen bolt spinning

Quote:
Originally Posted by MadViking View Post
That would be a 20" deep socket
Yep, thats right, make one.
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post #8 of 16 (permalink) Old 08-10-2019, 08:14 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Fork leg allen bolt spinning

It's a USD fork.
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post #9 of 16 (permalink) Old 08-10-2019, 10:05 AM
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Originally Posted by 2bag_ugly View Post
It's a USD fork.
You have the tool, just use an impact. Don't make the mistake of holding the trigger down. Just use short bursts and it will loosen 1/4 turn with each burst and spin right out.

Based on the photo, I'm guessing that you are using a drill. Not the same thing as an impact.

You may also consider taking the fork tubes apart first. There may be a hex at the top of the cartridge. I have seen that on different bikes.

Once the top cap has been removed, the only thing holding them together is the snap ring on the seal. Treat them like a slide hammer to get the seal out.

Last edited by MadViking; 08-10-2019 at 10:34 AM.
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post #10 of 16 (permalink) Old 08-10-2019, 03:29 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Fork leg allen bolt spinning

Not to contradict anyone but neither of my impact drivers will "impact" without resistance. Can't hammer air.


This is a picture of the other fork leg i got apart with no problem.
The aluminum piece I can see through hole A spins freely and moves longitudinally with no connection to rod B. This is all referred to as the "Damper assembly" in any exploded drawings I have seen and they don't tell you what parts comprise it. Even if I took it all apart from C down I don't know that I would be able to get the allen bolt out. I may be able to change the seals at that time but what a PITA.
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post #11 of 16 (permalink) Old 08-10-2019, 04:36 PM
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The silver part between A&B is what is spinning. That's the damper assy/cartridge. At the base of it, just to the left of A is the hex that the special tool retains.

I usually take everything above B apart. Then I take the damper out of the lower leg as described.

It will spin at the same speed as the allen if you hold the trigger down. The initial startup torque of the impact will spin it and then the cartridge catches up. Repeat...
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post #12 of 16 (permalink) Old 08-15-2019, 01:26 AM
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Re: Fork leg allen bolt spinning

Put a heat gun on the head and leave it there for 15 MINUTES. Not 5, 10 13 minutes but a solid 15, put a timer by it. If you actually keep the heat for a solid 15 that bolt will come flying out with your impact gun as if nothing was holding it in.
This is what i do every single time i have a stubborn bolt when doing forks or pretty much any difficult bolt. Has never failed and i have to do it about twice a week at the shop.
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post #13 of 16 (permalink) Old 08-15-2019, 01:31 AM
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Re: Fork leg allen bolt spinning

oh i forgot! keep the fork assembled to put pressure on the internals . Compress the fork and hit it with your impact after the 15MINUTES
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post #14 of 16 (permalink) Old 08-15-2019, 11:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 280SQUAGGLER View Post
Put a heat gun on the head and leave it there for 15 MINUTES. Not 5, 10 13 minutes but a solid 15, put a timer by it. If you actually keep the heat for a solid 15 that bolt will come flying out with your impact gun as if nothing was holding it in.
This is what i do every single time i have a stubborn bolt when doing forks or pretty much any difficult bolt. Has never failed and i have to do it about twice a week at the shop.
Your post confused me. First off, there won't be any finish left on the lower fork after 15 minutes unless you are using a hair dryer. Second, there is nothing inside the fork that would put pressure on the cartridge, unless it still has fluid in it and you push down on the shaft/piston and had compression cranked all the way up.
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post #15 of 16 (permalink) Old 08-16-2019, 01:27 AM
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Re: Fork leg allen bolt spinning

There will be finish, your putting the heat from under the fork not on the side. This is why i say 15minutes ..people always think less is better but you'll struggle to get it out. 15 is the number

You don't need fluid in there to compress the fork. Place the bottom of the fork in a vice and with your left hand compress the fork with your right hand and hit it with the impact gun.

I'm only speaking from experience not theory . I average a dozen set of forks a week so this is my go to tactic to get those stubborn bolts

I think your over thinking it, so don't do it. Gook luck

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post #16 of 16 (permalink) Old 08-16-2019, 10:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 280SQUAGGLER View Post
You don't need fluid in there to compress the fork. Place the bottom of the fork in a vice and with your left hand compress the fork with your right hand and hit it with the impact gun.

I'm only speaking from experience not theory . I average a dozen set of forks a week so this is my go to tactic to get those stubborn bolts

I think your over thinking it, so don't do it. Gook luck
I have only done it a few dozen times, so I dont have near your experience. However, you aren't doing shit but fighting the spring by compressing the fork. I believe you are under thinking it.

Next time you have one apart, you will see what I mean. The outer tube of the cartridge is bolted to the lower fork (with the allen). The shaft/piston is attached to the fork cap. Please explain HTF you are going to add pressure to the cartridge by compressing the fork, without fluid and the compression being maxed!

BTW, I'm not the one having trouble. My method spins the allen out no problem without heat.
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