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Old 11-06-2012, 05:10 AM   #1
Wurzel
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Kibblewhite Titanium Retainers

Hello,

i'am planning to buy some Titanium Retainers.

Now i've asked over my dealer the german Kibblewhite Importer.

They have a Set with the Kibblewhite Springs. But i think they are not necassary for my valve train, and too strong springs are also not good.

And they sell the Titanium Retainers alone without springs. But they couldn't tell me if they fit the original SRAD springs.

I would guess, that they fit also the original springs. But perhaps someone here has tried this already.
So that i would be on the safe side.


They have also no datasheet with the spring rate, which is also a bit sad.
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Old 11-06-2012, 06:05 AM   #2
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Re: Kibblewhite Titanium Retainers

Wurzel, go with a complete set, stainless valves springs and retainers! You will not be disappointed with the Kibble White!
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Old 11-06-2012, 08:12 AM   #3
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Re: Kibblewhite Titanium Retainers

What are the advantages of titanium parts for the valves?

Becaus my yoshimura valve spring kit also has titanium retainers.
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Old 11-06-2012, 08:49 AM   #4
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Re: Kibblewhite Titanium Retainers

less oszilation masses in the valve train.
Hard for me to explain in english what it is good for, so i let it be.


And i don't want to use stronger valve springs.
If i had a diagram with the spring rate i could calculate whether i can use them or not.
But if i use a stronger spring than necessary it has only disadvantages.

And using lighter retainers is a plus point for keeping the original springs.
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Old 11-06-2012, 11:24 AM   #5
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Re: Kibblewhite Titanium Retainers

Heavier springs are better for valve action at higher rpm's no?

In other words during racing circumstances?
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Old 11-06-2012, 02:28 PM   #6
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Re: Kibblewhite Titanium Retainers

Stronger springs are good for high RPM and high lift, or if the overlap is very tight. It will make sure the valve closes fast enough to not damage anything else.
Too stiff and you will loose power because it will be harder for the cam to push the valve open.

Lighter retainers make for less moving mass, in effect making the spring have to do less work for the weight of spring. So better valve movement.

That is the basics anyhow... I am sure a LOT more detail into why could be put up, but I dont think it is needed.

John
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Old 11-06-2012, 02:38 PM   #7
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Re: Kibblewhite Titanium Retainers

I use the kibblewhite springs with std retainers on my turbo bike
they require shimming to get standard seat pressures about 2mm
then the nose pressure is about 7-10 lb more than the original spring

i would definitely check the kibblewhite retainers as they may give a shorter installed spring height .
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Old 11-06-2012, 04:40 PM   #8
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Re: Kibblewhite Titanium Retainers

If Maj750 is right, you might run into a coil bind issue and that could be really bad.

John
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Old 11-07-2012, 01:54 PM   #9
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Re: Kibblewhite Titanium Retainers

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maj750 View Post
I use the kibblewhite springs with std retainers on my turbo bike
they require shimming to get standard seat pressures about 2mm
then the nose pressure is about 7-10 lb more than the original spring

i would definitely check the kibblewhite retainers as they may give a shorter installed spring height .
were the springs for the srad or for another bike?



KPM sells two different retainers.

Item # 60-6155 (where is a note, that they fit OEM Springs)
Item # 60-6114 (without note)

I will ask my dealer again, perhaps the importer has the original part number from the Kibblewhite Retainers. If they are the 60-6155 it should work.

But if the installed height of the spring is lower than original it could be a problem like GSX-R Freak said.

If the installed height is higher i could use shims under the Base washers. But the problem is where to get those shims alone, i think they need to be hardened.

Without shims in that case, i could get problems with the long life fatigue strength, because i need a certain lower tension (Unterspannung is the german word, didn't find a good translation)
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Old 11-07-2012, 03:44 PM   #10
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Re: Kibblewhite Titanium Retainers

these are the ones i buy
http://www.orientexpress.com/p-3611-...e-springs.aspx
i use stainless washers, they are available in 1mm thick , and fit neatly under the spring seat
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Old 11-07-2012, 04:02 PM   #11
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Re: Kibblewhite Titanium Retainers

nice prices over there.

Here i have to pay only for the retainers nearly 300, which is 380$


Set of Retainers and springs costs 500 -> 638 $
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Old 11-07-2012, 06:47 PM   #12
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Re: Kibblewhite Titanium Retainers

damn guess you need a parcel for the usa
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Old 11-07-2012, 07:33 PM   #13
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Re: Kibblewhite Titanium Retainers

Just under a G Note for the complete set up valves, springs, retainers and seals.
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Old 11-07-2012, 08:11 PM   #14
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Re: Kibblewhite Titanium Retainers

Thats why i use Orient, they send to Australia cheap and fast
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Old 11-08-2012, 05:43 AM   #15
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Re: Kibblewhite Titanium Retainers

Maj: Did you get only the outside spring? From the pick it look like a single spring! The ones I have looked at are dual inner/outer to prevent float and binding.
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Old 11-08-2012, 02:57 PM   #16
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Re: Kibblewhite Titanium Retainers

There dual spring , maybe the pic is not of the right springs
I run them with the adapted 07 gsxr1000 cams and hi boost on the 750, great lift capability and they last a long time, not had to replace any yet ,
just a trap for anyone thinking they will drop in without checking
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Old 12-20-2012, 01:12 PM   #17
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Re: Kibblewhite Titanium Retainers

got the titanium retainers.

They fit the original spring etc.

BUT!

stock: 3,6 gr
Kibblewhite Titanium: 5,4 gr

They are 1,8gr heavier than stock, which is a bit dissapointing.

I mean its titanium and they advert that their Ti Retainers als lighter than stock.

Last edited by Wurzel; 12-20-2012 at 01:20 PM.
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Old 12-20-2012, 01:28 PM   #18
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Re: Kibblewhite Titanium Retainers

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Old 12-20-2012, 01:41 PM   #19
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Re: Kibblewhite Titanium Retainers

pictures in the attachement


Quote from KPM Homepage:
Quote:
Titanium Retainers: To further reduce reciprocating mass
which is a lie than.


and i mean they are nearly exact the same measurements than stock.
And if they are really titanium, how is this possible?

i have a titanium link pipe at my exhaust, and it weighs nothing!
Attached Images
File Type: jpg IMG_8697.jpg (34.0 KB, 65 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_8700.jpg (163.7 KB, 65 views)

Last edited by Wurzel; 12-20-2012 at 01:45 PM.
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Old 12-20-2012, 03:11 PM   #20
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Re: Kibblewhite Titanium Retainers

Maybe if the new retainer was built to handle a stronger spring? Not really sure any other reason why.

John
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