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SS Motor Build Pro's/Con's

9K views 52 replies 10 participants last post by  !ThatGuy! 
#1 ·
This is especially for all you racers and trackaddicts as well as shops out there:

I am curious as to what the pro's and con's are to a SuperSport Engine Build? I am mainly talking in terms of reliability, HP gains, mapping, frquency of refreshes, cost of repair, cost in general, etc, etc. Just throw out what the Pro's and Con's are.

I am looking at buying a bike that has a supersport build by Markbilt, but would like to know if itd be worth it. I will be racing as well as attending many trackdays. My main concern is if it will be able to go a full race season + trackdays without a refresh. Here is what is in the build im looking at:

(per the guy im commincating w/ about his bike):

This was a super sport build which is typically the following.
Remove cylinder head
Measure squish (piston to head clearance)
Clean combustion chamber
Disassemble cylinder head
Inspect/prep valves
Inspect valve seats
Check valve spring pressures
Set cam journal clearance
Machine gasket surface
Clean/prep piston crowns and cylinder deck surface
Reassemble head and install
Slot cam sprockets or install cam adaptors
Check and adjust valve clearances to spec
Degree cams to spec
Install racing spark plugs


Any and all advice welcome. If im being an idiot considering a bike like this for trackdays AND racing on a budget PLEASE tell me. haha :cheers
It just seemed like a pretty good deal( '06GSXR w/ alot of goodies and a ss motor for under $5k)
 
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#31 ·
$5K is a good price on a bike with exhaust, levers, race plastic, etc...
Are levers really a serious factor of the value of a track bike to you?

You're going to start back up in the spring a little rusty. Get as much seat time as you can. When you are at the point where you feel VERY comfortable in Red group and you are running a pace that is good for the slower end of blue I would go ahead and take TPMs ART Race class. Part of the class is competing in the GP Moto race that day. You have to finish without crashing to get your certificate. You can send that cert in to CCS to get your amateur license and you also have TPMs license to do GP Moto races. You may find that the convenience of doing a race or 2 on the same day as being at the track appeals to you for that first year to get things started.
:stupid

TPM's GPMoto races are definitely a good place to get your feet wet.
 
#4 ·
He said 3 race weekends on the motor and its getting approx 115RWHP on an Eddy Current Dyno. I really dont even know what questions to ask they guy. So bring it on. More info yall give the better off I am.

the goodies include:
• Keyless ignition
• Traxxion extended Showa fork caps
• Penske double clicker shock also worked by Traxxion
• Full Ti Leo Vince
• PCIII and PC Ign Module with Markbilt map
• PC Quick shift in GP pattern
• SS lines front
• Vortex Clips ons
• Vortex Rear sets
• Vortex case covers
and more, just didnt feel like listing every tiny bit

I mean it would almost be worht it to just buy the bike based on the goodies alone! Fuck the motor. If it blows up I can replace it for approx $5-800. LOL
 
#5 ·
Sounds to me that the engine was just blueprinted. Maybe raised compression a bit if they milled the deck. If that is all they did, then it should last as long or longer than any engine out of the factory.

Edit - In my opinion and actual engine build would include porting/honing, cams, raised compression and possibly lighter/stronger rods and pistons etc.
 
#6 ·
would all that be supersport legal though?
 
#9 ·
OK, very good news. All parts and labor are on the up and up. Markbilt is a very reputible shop in this area of the world. See link--> http://www.markbiltracebikes.com/Markbilt/About_Us.html I didnt want an extremely built up motor for reliability reasons. But squeezing a few extra ponies never hurts. Thanks :cheers Out of curiosity, how often do you have to refresh your engine with the 127whp? Is it expensive to do so?

Good question. Supersport legal for what sanctioning body? I'm not familiar with wera or ama so someone else will have to chime in.
SS legal for CCS and/or WERA. CCS over WERA though. They have more events in my immediate area
 
#11 ·
I really think I am. I just want to cross my T's and dot my I's on this motor build first. Dont want to walk into a disaster as funds are limited. But it sounds more and more like this is a steal.
 
#13 ·
No pics yet, but promise I will post once I can :cheers
 
#15 ·
Dude, that motor is a slightly decked head and degreed cams.

The motor in mine has aftermarket cams (not sure what yet, but build sheet is coming), head work and more.

On MR12 it would make about 130whp.

Anyway, it needs to have the top end freshened every season to be safe... realistically it will probably be every two seasons. That's about 12 full day events a year, but I have the 1000 to play with as well on the faster tracks.
 
#16 ·
Hmm, ok so mine could prob get away with more time between refreshes considering it sounds like there was barely anything done to it and I will most likely run slightly over 7 full event race days and about 5-8 track days. The guy I might be buying it from said he is looking for the receipts for the build now. Hopefully that will shed more light on the situation. However, I would def want to do a refresh after every season anyways.

How much do refreshes usually run?
 
#17 ·
More HP does not a better rider make. It just means you'll have to keep a closer eye on your motor.

You've only done like 2 track days right> Keep at in on the SV and gain further experience. The fast you get on that SV the faster you'll be overall.
 
#18 ·
3 :fact

I am keeping the SV as well. Contemplating on racing the SV for a year or racing a 600 my first year. I keep weighing the pro's and con's of jumping to a 600 right away for racing vs staying on the SV.

I know that if I stay on the SV I will def learn how to be quicker without using HP as a crutch. But it would be nice to get over 120mph on the straights sometimes... :facepalm The way I see it, its not like Im jumping to a 1000. Its just a 600, which is practically a SV with more top end and less torque.

But IDK. Im just itching to go faster overall and have more options for races in a bigger field....bad idea, good idea? More input the better.
 
#52 ·
None of that matters when racing. You will be racing against other SV's.

Racing against other 600's you wont be using the HP as a crutch either. To be honest, that motor barely makes more than a stock motor with a full exhaust and a good tune, or maybe on U4. That "build" is VERY mild and would be fine for what you want.
 
#53 ·
None of that matters when racing. You will be racing against other SV's.

Racing against other 600's you wont be using the HP as a crutch either. To be honest, that motor barely makes more than a stock motor with a full exhaust and a good tune, or maybe on U4. That "build" is VERY mild and would be fine for what you want.
All good news! Thanks for input. The guy I'm buying from will be providing the build receipts so ill post those up whenever I get them for better eval. But yeah, sounds like its quite mild which is precisely what I wanted. Not buying the bike for the build, but the goodies and the fact it was technically just refreshed due to the "build".


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#19 ·
Sorry, 3 track days.

Get there first and then figure it out, you are thinking a little backwards still. Get into advanced group, get comfortable with the pace and the passing rules. Your mindset/priorities will change as your skill level improves. Make that your priority, not scoping out and buying bikes to race in classes that you're not yet qualified to compete in. Unless you have cash burning a hole in your pocket that you have no better use for.

After you've got your race license and maybe tried out a few GP Moto races that TPM does on for size then you can figure things out better. You're looking way too far ahead, concentrate on what you need to get done first in the short term.
 
#20 ·
True. I do tend to get ahead of myself over stuff I am really into. :lmao

I do have cash burning a hole in my pocket, but......I suppose I could use that money for a full year of trackdays and novice racing if I keep my SV. I just know that I will want to upgrade to a 600 eventually and I have the money for it now. IDK if I will have that same $$ by next year.

Overall though, the smart route would be to just keep riding the SV, get to blue group, attend a race school, do a few TPM races, AND THEN see if Im ready to step up to a I4 600. :dunno

EDIT: Yall have to remember though that my goal (whether yall think it is attainable or not, idc. this has been hashed out before in a diff thread and im not changing my mind :)) is to get to AMA racing as quickly as possible. I would think (I may be wrong) that racing a 600 right off the bat would help the cause in that respect.
 
#23 ·
Here is what I would do if I was in your shoes.....

I don't know if you are still in White group or if they bumped you to Red, but in either event I would do as many track days as you can reasonably do between now and late spring next year (I'm assuming since it's Nov 1st that your time at the track is going to be done for the year or close to).

You're going to start back up in the spring a little rusty. Get as much seat time as you can. When you are at the point where you feel VERY comfortable in Red group and you are running a pace that is good for the slower end of blue I would go ahead and take TPMs ART Race class. Part of the class is competing in the GP Moto race that day. You have to finish without crashing to get your certificate. You can send that cert in to CCS to get your amateur license and you also have TPMs license to do GP Moto races. You may find that the convenience of doing a race or 2 on the same day as being at the track appeals to you for that first year to get things started.

Based off how that experience goes you can decided what to do next with a little more certainty.
 
#24 ·
Very true as well. I already know I love trackdays. Im pretty sure I will love racing, though that is yet to be determined as I have not raced yet. The bike Im looking at is setup very well for a good price. Who is to say I cannot learn to go fast on a 600? Im sure other people have learned to go fast that way, and if not, I can always be the first :lmao :dunno

Ahh, too many choices. Its hard to determine what the best course of action is with some many varying opinions and options.
 
#26 ·
It's all good. I know that I have been riding since 6, used to race MX, been riding street for around 10 years and if I want to to buy a track bike and get into racing, I'll do it no matter what anyone else thinks.
The only reason I am not in the exact same place you are is that I make very little money at my job. When I can make more money, I'll be out every weekend at the track.
You can ask for people's opinions, that's great, but you will always have to consider their opinion along with your own direction and drive.
Do more track days for sure. I agree with everyone on that point. However, do them on a bike that inspires you too. You are obviously looking at different bikes, so find one that suits you. I am learning from your ideas too. Thanks to your other posts I have an idea of what it takes to even start thinking about getting started.
 
#33 ·
Ok, lets hypothetically say that I am going to buy the bike with the supersport built motor.

-cost of refresh?
-abnormal upkeep compared to a completely stock motor?
-any special way to warm up the motor after a cold start?
-anything at all a compete newb would need to know on a built motor?
 
#34 ·
A supersport motor is no different than a regular old stock motor off the showroom. Pretty much all you can do is run a more compression via a thinner head gasket or milled head and adjust the cams accordingly. Only thing you would have to be wary of is if the bike is tuned for and needs race fuel.

A superbike motor allows for more modification and has more lifespan concerns.
 
#35 ·
Ok, cool. The build and map were for regular ole 93 pump gas. Preferably with no ethanol.
 
#36 ·
Pics as promised if I bought it...........sorry SPL, had to get it. Hopefully it wont bite me in the ass :cheers

My new play thing for next season! Picking it up Sunday! :punk





 
#38 ·
No need to apologize.

Enjoy it, use the winter to go over it with a fine tooth comb and make sure everything is fresh for the spring. Things wear out quick on a dedicated track/race bike.
 
#39 ·
Nice bike!

So I know I'm a little late to this party but I'll throw in my two cents.

Thats a very mild motor, it's pretty much stock but cleaned up so maintenance shouldnt be a big deal. My bone stock 06 GSXR600 made 111 hp on fuel at the AMA round at Miller (4500 feet elevation). So that motor isnt anything crazy.

CHECK THE VALVES OFTEN! Not every 16,000 miles, not every 10,000... check it a few times a season if it's a track whore. We just broke a valve in an 07 with 4500 track miles. Ate the motor. It's worth a couple hours a few times a year to save that headache.

Now, dont spend any more on the bike and go to a good school and get really fast!
 
#40 ·
Thanks for the input! Thats what I keep hearing, that it's a very mild build. Which is exactly what I was hoping for. I dont want some blinged to the max motor that will pop after one season.

I dont NEED to spend anymore money on the bike. It literally has every single piece of aftermarket goodies I could possibly think of and then some. Planning on going to Cornerspeed at VIR this year and MAYBE hitting up a DiSalvo academy trackday with STT if I have the $$$.
 
#42 ·
Sounds like you have a solid plan. Best of luck to you next season. If your ever in our area let me know, Miller is a bunch of fun to ride.

JD has a great school, he's one of the Pro guys I really respect for what he gives back to the sport. He's really easy to talk to and is just a regular guy with a cool job.
 
#43 ·
List of the goods! The only thing I can think of is an aftermarket damper, but I dont really NEED that for quite a while

• Drilled / wired
• 520 Conversion
• Fresh fluids though out
• Keyless ignition
• ¼ turn gas cap
• Forks done Traxxion
• Traxxion extended Showa fork caps
• Penske double clicker shock also worked by Traxxion
• Full Ti Leo Vince
• PCIII and PC Ign Module with Markbilt map
• PC Quick shift in GP pattern
• K&N air filter
• New Wheel Bearings
• Brembo Master Cylinder 19x18 and SS lines front
• New Vesrah pads front
• New EBC HH pads rear
• Vortex Clips ons
• Vortex Rear sets
• Vortex case covers
• Bike has 3 race weekends on it (Markbilt in March of 2012)
 
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