Hi, my name is Richard and I am co-owner of Boyds Racing in Listowel, Ont. We are a full line Suzuki motorcycle dealership. We are into many upgrades for many makes of bikes, and our services are now going to include dyno services. Within the next week or so we will be taking delivery of a new Dyno-jet, model 200 dynomometer. We already build turbo bikes, nitrous bikes and offer many modifications, chassis, engine and bodywork. I would like your input on services for this dyno. I would like to know how many of you like to squeeze every last horsepower from your bike with the mods. you have already done, ( in other words how many of you would like to have your bike tuned to its full potential) and how many of you just like to have your bike put through a quick horsepower run. My thoughts were to use this dyno for tuning services through the week and do horsepower only runs on the weekends, this dyno will also have mobile capabilities, as we are hoping to take it to the Parry Sound Sport Bike Rally, among other events this year. I would like to post our prices here but I know the administrator frowns on it, but I will tell you they will be very reasonable. Please leave your input as replys to this topic, and for direct questions please email me. Thanks, Richard
boyds@wightman.ca

I'd like to know how much power my bike makes for sure.As fo rthe tunning,I don't think I want to mess with that stuff,but when I get a new bike I'll be defenitly doing that.

I'd be interested in tuning...especially if I got a full system for the 1000.... what kind/brand of exhaust systems do you guys like for good gains.... hindle...akra...yosh..etc....

if I did get a full system which do you like to remap...PC3... yosh ems...or the teilusion (sp???)

Thanks

Hindle systems have always made good power and are priced well. There are a few better systems, (Acro) but are high priced. I prefer to tune the powercommanders but can tune all the systems. I will be posting some dyno charts and some pics of our setup on our website within the next month. Check out our website www.boydsracing.ca (http://www.boydsracing.ca)
Thanks, Richard

There are a few things I'd look for as far as services...

1) Engine break-in
Like they say, you only have about 20kms to break it in right, and a dyno is the best, easiest way. A basic 'engine break-in' service would be cool.

2) Basic dyno runs
Just to get numbers -- the usual 3 runs for X amount of dollars.

3) Tuning
Everything from basic tuning (power commanders and what not) to some of the more serious power adders that require tuning (nitrous, boost, etc.)

4) History!
If there was ANY way to do this, this would be AWESOME! Keep a record of all dyno runs by a customer. If I could find a place that actually kept ALL my dynoplots on file (after every modification for example) not only would you have me as an aftermarket customer for life, but you could easily use those plots to help you sell certain products (numbers don't lie).

Anyhoo... just some ideas of things I look for.

I have to say that I'm not overly interested in the 200 model dyno for tuning. It get's expensive very quickly to do any "meaningful" tuning on it. Basically, everyone else in Ontario and the GTA has a similar dyno. So, there is no extra incentive to come to yours.

However, if the dyno was a 250 model with load control and tuning link software, then hallellujiah! You would have a set up that would be great. This really is the only set up to use when building fuel map and ignition maps for powercommander or Yosh EMS equipped FI bikes.

I know many people who would pay good money to extract the extra hp out of their bike, and the 250 model dyno makes that possible. A custom FI map is a natural way to maximize bike tuning, and to make the bike run at peak efficiency. As well, it will also optimize throttle response. Who wouldn't want that?

On the 200 dyno most people do a 4th gear roll on at full throttle. Really, this is good for only doing a hp measurement. Or building an optimal FI map for 100% throttle opening in 4th gear.

Any substantive kind of fuel curve tuning isn't worth the massive effort on this dyno.
Real tuning involve 5,10,20,40,60,80 and 100% throttle opening dyno runs with a lamda sensor to meaure the a/f ratio. Then this is used to help build a map. After all most riding is done in the 5-40% throttle range!



kw................

Hey kwtoxman, despite popular misconceptions, the load control is overrated. While the load control and tuning software will write you a decent map, it is far from having the ability to extract the last few hp from your bike. Now lets take into consideration how this setup works. First off the load control setup costs an extra $12500. It gives the user the ability to create a map in the range of 15 mins. Tell me the name of any shop that is going to charge out 15 mins. worth of work on a piece of equipment they have $40 000 into. You will still be charged the same dyno tuning time as a shop without the load control on their dyno. I would also like to issue a challenge to any customer that has had a map built by the load control software, that I can improve on it. It is not so much in the equipment, but in the operators ability to use it. Our dyno is coming with the high enertia drum and the air/fuel analyzer, this gives me the ability to check part throttle responses as well as wide open throttle and create a map for the complete throttle spectrum. The only real advantage to the load control would be if I had a bike that ran poorly or exibitted a problem at a specific rpm, then you could hold the bike at that rpm and diagnose the problem. Fortunately I have been in this business long enough that I do not have any difficulties dianosing this sort of problem, therfore the load contol is just a wasted expense. Also the load controller does nothing for the bikes that I install turbo systems on and have to build maps for the secondary fuel systems. Thanks, Richard

Hey lui kang, you hit the nail on the head with our approach to dyno services. Your first three examples are very common and the forth is also going to be included at Boyds Racing. When you have your bike tuned on the dyno, there will be a record kept of the customers name, address, bike and mods. on that specific date as well as the map that was created specifically for their bike. The customer will also recieve a floppy with this info on it. Then the next time they return, the last file can be brought up and updated, and changes to the map made accordingly. Therfore creating a history on specific customers bikes as well as allowing the customer to take a copy home with them. Thanks, Richard

Hey, Richard, I bought my current bike from y'all. http://www.gixxer.com/forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif I'm looking forward to seeing your 'projects' this year at Grand Bend. http://www.gixxer.com/forums/images/graemlins/cheers.gif

I may see y'all about doing a little 'something' for my new bike, even though it's the wrong make. I'm thinking wet (not dry). My pesky Hayabusa friend is about neck and neck with my new ride, gotta change that. http://www.gixxer.com/forums/images/graemlins/squid.gif

Hey silverbikeman what bike did you buy here, and what make, or more specifically, what is your current bike? The wet kits give you a little more piece of mind over the dry and is capable of higher horsepower levels. Thanks, Richard

Richard,

thx for the info. I've heard of some of the limitations of the tuning link capabilities, but I would have thought it would be the place to start. Build a map with it, and then fine tune the area's that could use the extra time.

I am using a custom built map for another 1K with similar mods, and there are some large swings in values in the fuel changes. Especially down low in the rpm. I would have thought building a map without tuning link would be time consuming because of these apparent differences. The map was further tweaked by a local shop here for max hp at 100% throttle opening.

But the bike runs well with the map.

I was wondering how much you would charge to tweak a map? Build a map? I would have thought that by trying to fill in the values on the fuel table it would take a lot of time without the tuning link software.

I have noticed that the bike is a touch weak in the 5500-6500 rpm range, and I haven't found a place capable of or willing to tweak this area of the map. I would assume this would mean using the a/f analyzer to analyze the map between 5000-7500 rpm between let's say 20% throttle opening and 100% throttle opening. Correct?

I'll spread the word on your services.

thx

kw..................

hi kwtoxman

just wondering how the ti force worked out... If i remember correctly you got a great deal on a used one off ebay... were you able to do a before and after dyno and if so what were the results...

Do you think the dip in power around 5500rpm is due to the loss of the set valve ???

I still haven't got a full system as of yet.. was kinda hoping the new 03 would require a diff. header or something and some used ones would come availble for a resonable price....
likely cheaper to get nos http://www.gixxer.com/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

later...

Hey kwtoxman, I am fairly certain I can straighten out the dip in power you are speaking of, and if I can't, you don't pay for it. You are right that I will use the air/fuel anylizer and check different throttle openings in that specific rpm range, but most likely when I see what the bike is doing I will have an idea of what needs tweeked. As far as a price goes, I would say it should be done in under an hour. Sorry I won't post a price on this site but if you email me I will give you a price.

CrazyCanuk, removal of the SET valve should open up midrange power, despite popular misconceptions, this vavle is nothing more then a restricter. Originally it was believed that this valve helped to create backpressure in lower rpm ranges for increased torque and horsepower. What this valve actually does, along with the secondary throttle plates, is limit throttle reponse in the lower gears. In other words if a rider wacks open the throttle in the lower gears the bike will respond slow and smooth. This makes the 1000 a more controllable bike for a wider range of riders. Now lets remove the SET valve and the secondary throttle plates, give the bike a bit of mapping and even the experienced rider will need to relearn how to ride this bike. Thanks, Richard

The Ti-force worked out awesome. I really like the system. Highly recommended.

As for the power dip, it isn't a dip per se, but it doesn gain hp as quickly at this point in the rpm scale as it does before and after the fact. It may be tweaked a bit with mapping, but it could be the characteristic of the ti-force exhaust. The ti-force system is noted for it's top end gains, similar to an akro evo. It isn't bothersome, but I'm a perfectionist.

With this exhaust on my bike I got 10 more rwhp. It dynoed the best at pro 6 of any gsxr1000 with similar mods. The pro 6 dyno is one of the most conservative in the GTA. I have posted a pic of the chart before and after here. But in real world terms, my bike dyno'd within 1.5 hp of a stock zx12 on that dyno. That is a better indication than the hp #!

http://members.rogers.com/kwtoxman/gsxr1000-150hp.jpg

And thx for the info richard, that is enough info for me. I will have to estimate how far I have to travel.