I've decided that after 2 years with the old Gix that it's time for a little motor work...that and winter will be over before I know it so I need to get it done now. I'm looking to put in a yosh head gasket and some sort of new cam combo and looking for the best possible option out there. I was looking into the Web cams offered for the Gix but I'm wondering how they compare to the Yosh stage 1 cams or if I should just go conservative and put the 750 inlet cam in the exhaust side and be done with it. bike is 80% riden onthe street so mid range power is more important than an absolute top end terror...but I believe that any of these combinations will do that as they're not race cams.

if it matters the bike has Ti-Force, PCIII, PAIR, TRE, and +2 on the rear sproket and YES it will be custom mapped after this is all complete.

andy

One of my riding buds has the yosh cams and said it was the biggest waist of money for what he got from them.. On the flip side the yosh cams are very reliable. For that matter so is the 750 in. cam and from what I have been told you will see more of an increase in power with the 750in. I have read where the web cams are not as reliable, meaning that there are harder on your valve train and require more maintenance. I am not saying the web cams them selfs are not reliable just that the valve train gets more work and requires more maintenance. I myself am going with the 750in. cam set up on mine.

Good question. I was wondering the same thing. I have no answers.
Although, I have heard that you must bump compression in order for cams to work proper. So, what I plan on doing is pulling off the head, getting it milled (10 thou), installing a thinner gasket, and I'm still trying to make myself believe that the 750 cam will suffice. But I've yet to see any hard results from cam specs or dyno results from the use of the 750 cam.
I'd like to see this thread get packed with more info.
Krispy

Krispy,
There's a thread somewhere around here reguarding dyno numbers for an individual after mods. His bike put out 175ph with the 750 cam in his bike. Now this bike did have the head milled and also had port work done to the head as well. This is what's making me think that for what my bike is intended for (mostly street) that the 750 cam is the way to go as it will yeild power in the middle of the rev range as well as a little more up top. I'm not going to be doing any port work on my head though...simply because I feel like it's too much of an investment for what I'm looking for....that and again I'm of the opinion right now that the head has pleanty of flow to make in the 170whp range without breaking a sweat.

All depends on what you are looking for (mid range, top end, etc), it roy are street riding or just doing track days. Also if your motor will have any other mods.

Tell us what you want to do....then we can help .

Jeffw
Basically the bike is ridden 80% of the time on the street, I do plan on attending 3-5 trackdays this summer depending on funds and vacation schedule. I'm Really looking for more mid-range power with possibly a little more grunt on top as well...which is why I'm really leaning towards the 750 cam over a full set of Webb or Yosh cams now. it would be nice to be able to put the bike on a dyno and see 170hp, but if it's in the 165 range and making much more power through the middle that would probably be Ideal.

As for the internals of the motor nothing will change, I do plan on putting on the thin yosh head gasket and I'm not alergic to milling the head. Maybe this is where your expertise will help me out. For the longest time I've been under the impression that porting the head will make good power numbers but at the expense of low and mid range power. If this is truely the case with the gixxer head then I will not be touching it other than possibly milling.

Thanks for any other input you can give...

bump

Do you have to drop the motor to take the head off?,..my bike is not here and I can't look/never done it.

What prep work on the head is required if you plan on having it shaved?


I'd like to see the dyno numbers on this mod http://www.gixxer.com/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif


I'm having a custom map/dyno tuned as we speak/type,.... whatever.


Thanks

Krispy

Ok, here is what I have found out on the camshafts.
First off: Yosh cams have a little more lift and the same deration as stock.
Web cams have more lift and deration alot more on the intake side.
750 intake cam has almost the same lift and deration as the Web exhaust cam.
I just had some head work done by Schnitz and with talking to Karry he said the head flows
pritty good stock. He said that they shoot for a min. of 65% of flow(intake to exhaust)
My head flowed on avrage 67%. There are to ways to get that number higher. 1 is to port the head, and if you can't get it out of the head then do it with cams.
So with that said, the 750 intake cam is a very good idea. You will get more flow on the exhaust side which will put your 67% up higher(70% for example) the higher the percent the more HP..This is why people are going with the 750 intake and it's cheeper.
Karry said that he though it's the way to go, at least for more top end.About 5 hp.
I hope this helps
PS don't spend the money to port the head. Very min. gains for 1000cc.The head flowed very well stock.

So is that the 750 Intake cam on the exhaust side of the 1000 or the 750 exhaust cam? You mention both above.

What year of 750 is that? and do you still need to change the valve springs? (I'm thinking the answer is yes)

You think the HP gain will only be about 5 HP or 5 HP less from the Webb Cams?

Krispy

Krispy said:

So is that the 750 Intake cam on the exhaust side of the 1000 or the 750 exhaust cam? You mention both above.

What year of 750 is that? and do you still need to change the valve springs? (I'm thinking the answer is yes)

You think the HP gain will only be about 5 HP or 5 HP less from the Webb Cams?

Krispy



That was a typeO on my part. It's 750 intake cam put in the GSXR1000 exhaust side.

2000-2002 750.
Valve springs- NO (The springs are not the problem with the 1000, it's the valve seat pressor that is the problem. You can shim up your old springs.)

HP gain - about 5HP over stock

The yoshimura stage-1 cames are not the same as stock. Here are a few cam types. The Yosh/750 is a combo between the yoshimura stage 1 intake and a 750 intake on the exhaust.

http://www.pro-libertate.com/images/cam.jpg


Adding any of the above cams sets will not give you you desired 170 hp, you must go into the engine and increase compression (milling and or installation of the yosh gasket), and other head work.

so whats the cost of the 750 cams compared to yoshi?

The 750 intake cam from Ron Ayers (http://www.ronayers.com/browseparts.cfm?searchstring=12710-35f00) is $144.48

Krispy said:

Do you have to drop the motor to take the head off?,..my bike is not here and I can't look/never done it.

What prep work on the head is required if you plan on having it shaved?





I think I want to shave the head some, and install a 750 intake cam on the exhaust side of my 1000, and also install a thinner gasket. Any answers on the above questions?

Thanks

Krispy

Krispy said:


Krispy said:

Do you have to drop the motor to take the head off?,..my bike is not here and I can't look/never done it.

What prep work on the head is required if you plan on having it shaved?





I think I want to shave the head some, and install a 750 intake cam on the exhaust side of my 1000, and also install a thinner gasket. Any answers on the above questions?

Thanks

Krispy






There are contrarians that have reported getting the head off with the engine in the bike. It is far easier to just drop it. The motor pretty much has zippers on it. It is also easier to time the cams with the motor on the bench.

The head must be completely stripped to mill it. The valves have to come out. Good time to freshen up the valve job and replace the seals.

A good plan is to buy a complete 750 head used. The wrecking yards strip the heads, but private parties often sell them complete. You get the 750 valve springs, the cams, and can take your time with the machine work. If you're lucky, it will have the updated retainers in it. They go for $150 - $200 for the complete ones. I've seen them sit in the for sale section of this board for months at that price. When you're done, you can sell your 1K head, people seem to want them worse for some reason. Or you can save it for a clear path of retreat.

Are the 750 head and the 1000 head identicle?
on 2001-02 bikes?
Krispy

Krispy said:

Are the 750 head and the 1000 head identicle?
on 2001-02 bikes?
Krispy




The head casting and valves are the same. The springs and cams are different

So if I just drop in (no degreeing, unchanged 1K headgasket) the 750 intake cam on the exhaust side of my 01 1000, (engine is stock),
my peak hp goes up about 5 hp, anybody measure what the rest of the power curve looks like? thanks!

I would think you need to degree the cam, as you are required to put on an adjustable cam sprocket on the 750 cam, prior to installing it.

I don't think dropping in the 750 cam (with adjustable sprocket) will yield 5 HP. Its not that easy. Like almost anything else, you need to tune it, to get it to work efficiently.

Krispy

Krispy said:

I would think you need to degree the cam, as you are required to put on an adjustable cam sprocket on the 750 cam, prior to installing it.

I don't think dropping in the 750 cam (with adjustable sprocket) will yield 5 HP. Its not that easy. Like almost anything else, you need to tune it, to get it to work efficiently.

Krispy






Degree your cams in104/ex109...
This will get you very good top end!

Unless you have a head with a ton of casting drift ( it does happen ), all the "porting"
would be done within an inch or so of the valve seat itself. If your head is "normal' you will pick up a little. Changing the throat angle ( the one just below the 45 ) is really part of a valve job, not porting. There is very little smoothing required. If your casting sucks,get a better head,and spend your money on that one.

Okay FROM mY EXPERIENCE (not what i've heard or read):

I have a full Yosh TRS race system on my 1000....Now I got a set of cams free (Yosh ST-1) cams, so i figured why not put them in?
From everyone I talked to, they said the Yosh ST-1 will only give you ~2hp http://www.gixxer.com/forums/images/graemlins/ooo.gif which I was really disappointed to hear, but they were free, so who cares?!
I put the cams in, and set them at stock timing (105/105)....and dyno'd the bike I got 6.4rwhp out of the cams - which i am quite pleased with (that was dyno'd on a dynojet cyno with high inertia drum, and SAE corrected)...

The cams are a peice of cake to put in, it's just doing the timing is somewhat teadeous............

Has anyone tried the Yosh Type R cams?

sweet2bad said:

Okay FROM mY EXPERIENCE (not what i've heard or read):

I have a full Yosh TRS race system on my 1000....Now I got a set of cams free (Yosh ST-1) cams, so i figured why not put them in?
From everyone I talked to, they said the Yosh ST-1 will only give you ~2hp http://www.gixxer.com/forums/images/graemlins/ooo.gif which I was really disappointed to hear, but they were free, so who cares?!
I put the cams in, and set them at stock timing (105/105)....and dyno'd the bike I got 6.4rwhp out of the cams - which i am quite pleased with (that was dyno'd on a dynojet cyno with high inertia drum, and SAE corrected)...

The cams are a peice of cake to put in, it's just doing the timing is somewhat teadeous............



Did you check the stock timing on the OEM cams?
Is it not possible that most of the gain came from the correct degreeing of the cams?

GIXXER THE KID said:


Krispy said:

I would think you need to degree the cam, as you are required to put on an adjustable cam sprocket on the 750 cam, prior to installing it.

I don't think dropping in the 750 cam (with adjustable sprocket) will yield 5 HP. Its not that easy. Like almost anything else, you need to tune it, to get it to work efficiently.

Krispy






Degree your cams in104/ex109...
This will get you very good top end!



The 104in/109ex setting is more for a top end hit???
What would be a good setting for more of mid-range hit?

stam said:Did you check the stock timing on the OEM cams?
Is it not possible that most of the gain came from the correct degreeing of the cams?




Beleive it, or not, my stock timing was at 105/105!!! http://www.gixxer.com/forums/images/graemlins/applause.gif SO all i did was throw in the new cams and run it on the dyno!

the 750 cam mod is only good from 7000rpm and up...Below that you do lose a little..
It moves you peek torque up in the power Band and give you a nice flat peek from 8000rmps to 10000rpms... That's a flat peek torque!!!