I did my first track day this past weekend and had a blast! I took the beginner class and the first time on the track we took it slow. They grouped everyone in the class in four or five groups depending on skills and past experience.

The second time we went out I was in the fastest group right behind the teacher/leader. There was a fella on a yellow Duc right behind me. We took about 4 laps at moderate pace. At the beginning of the straightaway the Leader looked back and noticed that the guy on the Duc and I were the only ones still with him. The other guys in our group started to follow a slower group or decided to go in the pits or something. Seeing this, the Leader waved us to follow him. We passed a slower group along the straightaway and then really turned it on.

This was the fastest that I've ever taken curves. At no time did I feel out of control or that I couldn't make the curves but I knew that I was riding at a higher level than ever before. I was hitting the lines and the bike was going exactly were I wanted it to go. What a great feeling.

Well, I entered a right hand turn. Leaned the bike over and started to roll on the throttle. I was right were I wanted to be. I didn't have to make any mid turn adjustment or anything. Just passing the apex of the turn, my rear tire slides out and down I go, bodysurfing the asphalt. My bike slide down on the right side and then flips over on it's left. The frame saver and bar saver broke on the right side but the frame and swing arm were untouched. Both rear sets were broken off and scratches on all the bodywork.

The Corner flagman said that it looked like my foot peg dug in. I did not think that I was at maximum lean angle. I was scraping my boot but not my knee. Although the guy behind me said that I would of if I had knee sliders on. The instructor said that I might have broken the rear tire loose with too much throttle. (He felt really bad because he knew that we were going fast for a beginners but he felt confident in our riding ability.) I was in third gear instead of second and I was really trying to be smooth in the turns.

Before anyone starts slamming me about riding too fast for my skills, I was hitting the lines and the bike was going right were I wanted it to go. What an awesome feeling. The guy on the Duc that was behind me told me that I was a good rider and he was basically following my lines. He has done other tracks but not Beaver Run. I do feel that you have to push your limits to get better. Was I pushing them too much? I don't think so. I would not have taken those turns that fast if I was on the street.

I really wish that I knew what I did wrong. I felt really solid in the turns. I'm just not experienced enough to read the feedback that the bike was giving me. To me everything felt really good. Can anyone give me advice or suggestions of what I did wrong?

I really can't wait to do another track day. I got the certificate to go to the intermediate class but I think I'm going to take another beginner class to try and learn more.

My 98 gsxr750 is now a certified track bike!

Sorry about the long post.
Thanks,
Brian

I was at Beaver Run also this past weekend. I rode in the intermediate group and only did the morning session.

As for what happend, I can only speculate...but I did see one person go down in the morning on an RC51. He was comming out of the turn and got on the throttle too hard and the back tire let go. I noticed was that the track surface was real good except my tires got greasy really fast. Sounds like you were riding pretty hard for a while and might have jump the throttle a little hard and the back tire just let go.

As for dragging your pegs (I think yours are spring loaded, right?), I was dragging mine quite a bit all day and the only thing that would make you dump it while doing this is if you REALLY were leaned over far or if you paniced when they hit.

Let me know if you plan to go up there again this year...I'm thinking about going up again Sunday.

Hopefully you'll be able to get your bike back together soon....and by the way, how are you? Hopefully the leathers did their job.

Loth,
Thanks for the help. I must have tried to use too much gas. My pegs are spring loaded. I can't imagine that I was leaning over enough for them to dig in. What really sucks is that I thought that I was really doing good. images/icons/rolleyes.gif

I will be up there Sunday, not with my bike but just to watch and maybe do some corner work.

My Gixxer is scratched on both sides. both rearsets are ripped off. The frame slider and bar end slider on the right side broke off. I'm hoping to do one more track day this year.

I'm fine, not a scratch. I have a new respect for leathers!

Thanks,
Brian

First off...Welcome to the true addiction.

Scenario #1 Scraping hard parts(if in fact you did) will lever the rear tire off the pavement enough to cause a lowside situation. Cure: get some leathers with knee sliders and hang off the bike more. In this way you will decrease lean angle and conserve traction by not dragging hard parts or riding on the ragged edge of your tire.

Scenario #2 Standard lowside by losing the rear.
Cure: again...hang off bike more. Less lean angle generally means more contact patch and thus more traction. Also...if you're not hanging off the bike and have it leaned to the hilt...throttle control becomes veeeeery important!

Conclusion...IMO start hanging off more and the problem will eliminate itself.

Sorry ya binned it on your first trackday, but it sounds like you're hooked so it's all good. images/icons/smile.gif

Were you hanging off at all? I think the peg thing sounds about right. Yeah, they are spring loaded, but if you have your weight on the inside peg when it hits, it's not going to spring out of the way, and will take traction away from the rear. If you were scraping your boot, then I think you need to hang off more, like poacher said.

Hmm, crashing at the track the first day out . . . and the bike becomes a trackbike. Now that sounds familiar images/icons/rolleyes.gif . . . images/icons/smile.gif

One other thing...if you still have the peg feelers on your bike...Get rid of them..

I would say that Poacher covered the likely causes..Also make sure the pressure in your tires is good..if ya have 207's for instance..run about 30 lbs of air..too much air can cause them to not offer enough grip..and you may want to consider getting some sticker tires...race take off's in good cond. are a great way to try out different brands..cause you can get em pretty cheap... images/icons/grin.gif

It's really not that hard to hang off...just see the turn coming, scoot your butt halfway off the seat, lock your outside leg into the tank and lean your body in the direction of the turn, all in one motion a bit before you throw the bike down.

I'm still a bit sketchy throwing it over too quickly in slower corners, but i'm getting better about it. Part of it is just experience. A lot of less experienced riders (i'm trying to cure it myself) tend to turn in rather slowly, so the line may look smooth, but you're spending a lot of time pushing on the clip-ons and not enough time at the right lean...

Glad to hear you walked away fine. I have recently
been to my first few track days & had the rear tire start to go, luckly I did not go down.
It's an addiction. Now get that bike geady for the next event. graemlins/thumbup.gif

Sucks you crashed but it sounds like you are in good spirits. Some things to cure your problems are obviously hang off more-but also you should raise the ride height of the rear to give your bike more ground clearance. Also try some shorter solid mount pegs that are grippier-they won't drag as early, your boots won't slide off them as easily to drag, and they can act like a frame slider when you go down. I only went up 4mm in the back and I thought my knee puck had fallen off when I took it to the track because I was used to it dragging at a certain lean angle and I had to go MUCH further to get it down graemlins/thumbup.gif Do a search in here and on the club racer forum on body positioning and you will find a lot of good info. good luck out there next time graemlins/thumbup.gif

-Spooner

On top of everything else that people have mentioned...were you on the stock 207s? When I was still using mine at the track, I found that too little pressure and too much time at the track got them pretty greasy towards the end of a session...cured that by using better tires.

As for dragging boot, you may want to check foot position, too. I know a lot of guys tend to duck-foot a bit and don't ride on the balls of their toes, so they drag boot all over (one guy i met at the last track day actually uses his boots as a lean indicator, but i don't think most people do).

Another issue may be that track surfaces aren't regular, so wicking it up a notch without testing the surface a bit in different corners can be trouble...

Dunno what happened for sure, could be a lot of things, really...

I'm glad to hear you made it out with a scratch!!!I agree, sounds like you are not hanging off the bike enough. I have the same problem which I'm attempting to cure. I scape my boots and pegs, but not my knee. I've gotten better since concentrating on weighting my outside leg.

Good luck!

Wow, thanks for all the help guys,

I was leaning off but probably not as much as I should. I know that I was not weighing the outside peg. I remember reading about weighing the outside peg in the "Twist of the Wrist" book. It must have slipped my mind with all the other stuff that I was trying to remember to do.

I was running the stock 207's with 32 psi. Although I checked the air in the morning, I should have checked it when the afternoon when it was a lot warmer out. The psi probably went up some.

Thanks again for all the help. I'm going to the track this weekend and take some videos of guys taking the corners. I'm also going to ask around about suspension setups. I've got a lot to learn.

THANKS,
Brian

Hey Brian,

sorry to hear about your get off. glad to hear that it still sounds like you loved it and you'll be back.

here's a tip that Tony Iannarelli, http://www.samnet.net/racingrep/Results/loudonsummary.htm , always preaches to us. he just won the "Lightweight GP" championship.

he uses a technique he calls the "ratchet". when accelerating through a turn, twist the throttle one click. if it feels solid and there's no slip, give it another click. continue this though the day until you're happy with the amount of throttle you give through that turn or until you feel a slip. **if you feel the back break loose, hold the throttle at that spot - the rubber will grab again and you know that's the limit. if you let off, you might highside. when people "roll" on the throttle, sometimes they feel the slip too late = lowside. with the ratchet technique, you actually stop rolling on the throttle and feel for feedback before adding more.

it's worked for me thusfar, but i wouldn't say i'm nearly as good as half the guys that have already posted. give it a try and see how you like it.