Seeing how my body is tired in all the wrong places I obviously have much room for improvement when it comes to my form. I would really appreciate it if you guys could give me some suggestions/advice to improve my form. One of my buddies told me I need to lay on the tank more and it seems like that is what I need to do. But the big question is how can I hang off without putting excessive weight in the inside pegs?

I noticed that a couple of times when I went very low the bike would wobble as if I'm running on the edge of the tire. But I know for a fact I wasn't going THAT low because the pegs would've scraped first. But now that ant f from the other thread mentioned weighting the inside is a really bad thing I'm suspecting that's my culprit. I really want to get the bike to lean more but it seems like everytime I do I get that unsettling wobbly feeling from the tires.

Here are some pics from my last track day:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v652/WillWong927/CP2_1872.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v652/WillWong927/CP2_2112.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v652/WillWong927/CP2_3885.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v652/WillWong927/CP2_3889.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v652/WillWong927/CP2_3895.jpg

Some from a few months back before I did track days:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v652/WillWong927/Angelescrest.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v652/WillWong927/pic6.jpg

Looks good on the track bro. Now what are you scared of about sticking your knee out?.?.?....

Just do what you're used to and OPEN YOUR LEGS!!!!
J/K man
LOL

Once you put you knee into the ground you'll feel a leverage point.

I would also suggest, and you may or may not feel comfortable with it, but I prefer to have my weight a little more forward and my elbows up and out when going through a corner not tucked up against my sides like you would down a straight. This goes back to my old motocross days, but having your elbows up and out more allows you to have much more leverage and control over the front end, it also helps to have clip-ons that you can adjust forward so they are not as swept back as the stockers. Now you know why Spies rides like this......

http://www.amasuperbike.com/adm/upl/kgp217bx6m_1177100219.jpg

http://www.parts-unlimited.com/images/racenews/spies-4.jpg

Like an old MX school coach once told us, when you are using a shovel to dig up a pile of dirt, do you think you can dig and throw the dirt easier with your elbows up and out or with them down and at your sides.





As far as weighing the pegs goes, it's simply a matter of whose opinion you want to take. Keith Code suggests weighing the outside peg in a corner. Most others seem to recommend weighing the inside peg

Kevin Schwantz recommends weighing the inside at corner entry and the outside at the apex amd exit of the corner.

Looks good on the track bro. Now what are you scared of about sticking your knee out?.?.?....

Just do what you're used to and OPEN YOUR LEGS!!!!
J/K man
LOL

Once you put you knee into the ground you'll feel a leverage point.


I actually made a thread before asking why my knee refuses to stick out. I realized that it's because I don't pivot my foot. I can get it to pivot around when I'm sitting on the bike on the stand, but once I'm hanging off around a corner I can't do it.

That's one of the many things I need to work on. Up until this track day I haven't dragged knee but was able to keep up or ride faster than guys who do drag knee. I dragged my knee twice in the last track day, and that was when I felt like I was completely decked out and the tire started wobbling.

As I said I think I just need more lean angle because a lot of guys I see who drag knee don't even have their knee stuck out. But of course those are the really fast guys.... I pretty much gave up on dragging knee and just told myself that when I become fast enough the knee will touch down even if I don't stick it out.

I would also suggest, and you may or may not feel comfortable with it, but I prefer to have my weight a little more forward and my elbows up and out when going through a corner not tucked up against my sides like you would down a straight. This goes back to my old motocross days, but having your elbows up and out more allows you to have much more leverage and control over the front end, it also helps to have clip-ons that you can adjust forward so they are not as swept back as the stockers. Now you know why Spies rides like this......

http://www.amasuperbike.com/adm/upl/kgp217bx6m_1177100219.jpg

http://www.parts-unlimited.com/images/racenews/spies-4.jpg

Like an old MX school coach once told us, when you are using a shovel to dig up a pile of dirt, do you think you can dig and throw the dirt easier with your elbows up and out or with them down and at your sides.





As far as weighing the pegs goes, it's simply a matter of whose opinion you want to take. Keith Code suggests weighing the outside peg in a corner. Most others seem to recommend weighing the inside peg

Kevin Schwantz recommends weighing the inside at corner entry and the outside at the apex amd exit of the corner.

Yea that's what one of my buddy told me..... to lay on the tank by putting my upper body more forward. I'll give that a try next time I go ride. What I noticed is that when I'm going around a corner.... a lot of my weight is weighted towards my butt, so I'm basically pulling on the bars instead of pushing against it like the pic you showed of ben spies.

I'll just need to work on my body positioning so that I can weight the outside pegs. Because everytime I give it a lot of throttle going out of a turn my rear feels loose/unstable. And I couldn't power out as fast as I would like to. I think that has to do with me putting too much weight on the inside peg.

Now that I think about it I realized that all the ama/wsbk/motogp guys all are basically in a "tuck" position whether it's on a straight away or in corners.... only times they're sitting straight up is when they're braking. I'm eager to try it out now :D

Up until this track day I haven't dragged knee but was able to keep up or ride faster than guys who do drag knee. I dragged my knee twice in the last track day, and that was when I felt like I was completely decked out and the tire started wobbling.


Instability is usually caused by rider error (making corrections, choppy etc) and/or poor setup.



As I said I think I just need more lean angle because a lot of guys I see who drag knee don't even have their knee stuck out. But of course those are the really fast guys....

http://moteroweb.eresmas.com/jarama2.jpg

It is about lean angle but also corner speed. Unloaded bike sits higher.

I can do novice level lap times without dragging knee. And when I get to speed, I dont drag that much. So, yes it is possible to go fast (for a trackday rider) without dragging knee.



[QUOTE]
I pretty much gave up on dragging knee and just told myself that when I become fast enough the knee will touch down even if I don't stick it out.

Good idea. You may just want to focus or your riding and a little bit on your form.

It is understandable to want to drag knee... it is cool and stuff... but it is missing the point.

Instability is usually caused by rider error (making corrections, choppy etc) and/or poor setup.

[QUOTE]

As I said I think I just need more lean angle because a lot of guys I see who drag knee don't even have their knee stuck out. But of course those are the really fast guys....

http://moteroweb.eresmas.com/jarama2.jpg

It is about lean angle but also corner speed. Unloaded bike sits higher.

I can do novice level lap times without dragging knee. And when I get to speed, I dont drag that much. So, yes it is possible to go fast (for a trackday rider) without dragging knee.





Good idea. You may just want to focus or your riding and a little bit on your form.

It is understandable to want to drag knee... it is cool and stuff... but it is missing the point.

I had my suspension setup at one of the vendors but it didn't seem to improve all that much. As you said it is rider error because my buddy on a k2 600 can drag pegs all day long with the same tires I have (2ct's). So I know for a fact that I can go lower but it might be a problem with me weighting my inside pegs too much causing the bike to be unstable.

BTW. observe gp guys on the brakes. You will notice that the butt cheek is already off the seat, and knee out. Rider just turns, and lays low...but not changing anything else.

Just work on that and the basics. Dont over brake and the the bike "run". Once off the brakes, back on the gas - even if just a little and feed it (more and more as you get confortable for REAL hard gas). Never ride with the the throttle shut, costing the bike. Pay attention to what you are doing :)

BTW. observe gp guys on the brakes. You will notice that the butt cheek is already off the seat, and knee out. Rider just turns, and lays low...but not changing anything else.

Just work on that and the basics. Dont over brake and the the bike "run". Once off the brakes, back on the gas - even if just a little and feed it (more and more as you get confortable for REAL hard gas). Never ride with the the throttle shut, costing the bike. Pay attention to what you are doing :)

Thanks for the advice man :cheers

So right now things to improve:

1) Get butt off the seat and foot/knee into position before I start braking.

2) Lay down on the tank through corners.

3) Weight the outside peg.

Dont fool around with wieghing the pegs. Just push, pull the bars. Regarding the pegs, it dont turn the bike, just is an aid to lean it over. pushing the inside peg, the like with dirtbikes you wiegh the outside peg when on the gas to keep the rear slides in check and pull the bike up (ASAP). The longer you are leaned over, the slower.